Bob 'n Joyce Talk HR 'n OD

Today we take on leadership models—and ask whether we may be putting far too much faith in them.

Thirty years ago, leaders watched and emulated GE CEO Jack Welch, following his leadership formula chapter and verse. His approach was studied, taught, copied, and widely held up as a model for how great organizations should be led. Today, much of what seemed like enduring leadership wisdom from that era feels remarkably dated—and some of it downright absurd.

And Welch is hardly alone. Leadership history is littered with models, formulas, and “best practices” that once seemed unquestionably right, only to lose their relevance as the world around them changed.

Which brings us to AI. We are entering a period of extraordinary change where none of us really knows what organizations, work, or leadership will look like even a few years from now. If the world is changing faster than our leadership models can keep up, what sense does it make to keep creating them?

Maybe the answer isn’t another model at all.

In this episode, we push beyond the familiar leadership playbook and offer a few out-of-the-box ideas about what leadership might need to become in a world that refuses to stand still. Some may challenge what we’ve been teaching leaders for years.

And maybe that’s exactly the point.

In today’s episode, Bob ’n Joyce take on a question that has followed us throughout our careers: Where can you do your best and boldest OD work—from inside an organization or from the outside?

We’ve done both. And while we believe some of our most impactful work came from being inside the organization, there are real advantages—and some very real traps—to both.
Internal OD practitioners have an intimacy with the business that’s hard to replicate. They understand the culture, know the players, and can build credibility and trust over time. But that closeness can also get in the way. Internals can become too embedded in the system to see what needs to change—or find themselves spending too much time doing routine, low-impact work.

External OD practitioners bring fresh eyes, a clearer mandate, and often the freedom to say things others won’t. But distance has its costs. Externals can miss important nuances, remain at arm’s length from what’s really happening, or unintentionally create a dependency that leaves the organization less capable when they leave.

So maybe the real issue isn’t internal versus external. Maybe it’s understanding the traps that come with where you sit—and refusing to let them keep you from doing the work that really matters.

Join us as we wrestle with what it takes to do great OD work, wherever you sit.

What can a transition expert writing three decades ago teach us about navigating AI’s impact on work? As it turns out, quite a lot.

In this episode, Bob 'n Joyce revisit William Bridges’ vision of the optimal workplace and consider it through the lens of the AI transformation now underway. Bridges’ work stands the test of time because, although the world of work has changed dramatically, what people need to feel connected, capable, and committed has not.

Bridges uses the metaphor of a trapeze artist suspended between two bars—what was is no longer there, and what comes next has not yet arrived. With the rapid rise of AI, that is where many organizations and their people find themselves today. It is an uncomfortable and often paralyzing place, filled with uncertainty, loss, and fear.

So, what can leaders and OD practitioners do to help people navigate this in-between time? Bridges points toward the kind of workplace we need—one where:

• People are invested in the outcomes of their work.
• Leaders and managers are committed to the highest standards.
• Expectations are clear.
• Employees receive reliable feedback from the customers they serve.

Joyce and I build on Bridges’ thinking by putting forward several practical first steps leaders and OD practitioners can take right now. We don’t pretend to have all the answers, but we believe these actions can help organizations move through uncertainty with greater clarity, connection, and confidence.

AI may be transforming the work, but it does not eliminate the human needs that make work meaningful.

Come join us.

What happens when the pace of technological change exceeds our human and organizational capacity to absorb it?

In this episode, Bob ’n Joyce explore that question in the context of a convergence of technological forces unlike anything we have experienced before. Amy Webb, renowned futurist and CEO of the Future Today Institute, believes we are entering a technology “supercycle”—the coming together of AI, advanced sensors, and biotechnology in ways that could fundamentally reshape how we live, work, lead, and organize.

The question isn’t whether Webb has every detail of the future exactly right. It’s whether leaders and organizations are prepared for the magnitude and speed of the change she sees coming.

Joyce even wonders whether organizations should be hiring only people under 30 to help them prepare for what’s ahead—which is a bit ironic coming from two people over 65. But perhaps that’s part of the point: preparing for the future will require fresh perspectives, hard-earned wisdom, and the humility to recognize that none of us has this figured out.

Join us for a provocative conversation about what this means for leaders, organizations, and especially those of us who practice OD. We help organizations prepare for change—but are we prepared to change ourselves?

In this episode, we revisit a tried-and-true formula for assessing the likelihood that a change effort will succeed—or fail. We’re talking about the Beckhard-Harris Change Equation:

D × V × F > R

We road-test the formula against today’s frenetic pace of change. Too often, senior leaders have been thinking about a change for months before employees hear a word about it. By then, leaders are ready to move—but everyone else is just beginning to make sense of what’s happening. No wonder resistance follows.

We like this tool because it is simple, straightforward, and practical. It reminds us that successful change requires three things: dissatisfaction with the current situation, a compelling vision for the future, and confidence in the first steps forward. Together, they must be strong enough to overcome resistance.

Like any tool, it has limitations. The equation is best used as a readiness test—not as an implementation plan. It can tell you whether the conditions for change are present and where the weak spots may be. It cannot lead the change for you.

Here’s the formula:

D = Dissatisfaction with the current situation
V = Vision for the future
F = First steps—or belief in the path forward
R = Resistance to change

In a world where change keeps coming faster, this simple formula may be more useful than ever.

In this episode, we take on something pretty basic to being human—our need to connect with other people.

Friends, family, people at work. We need each other. Yet loneliness, isolation, and anxiety seem to be everywhere. Maybe part of the antidote is right in front of us: getting better at building and keeping strong relationships.

The problem is, good relationships don’t just happen. They take work. Life gets busy. We get comfortable. We stop having the conversations that matter. And before we know it, people we care about—or work beside every day—aren’t as connected to us as we think they are.

Why does this matter? Because relationships are the glue that holds families, communities, teams, and organizations together. And at work, all the strategies, processes, and clever ideas in the world don’t mean much if people don’t trust one another.

We offer an exercise to take a look at your own connections and a practical way to strengthen them. For us, it comes down to three things:
Humility — I need you to become a better me.
Intentionality — We have to make the time and space for conversations that matter.
Trust — I value you. I can count on you. And you can count on me.

So here’s the question we leave you with: Who in your life could you be better connected to?
Maybe it’s time to stop thinking about it and start a conversation.

Long before a facilitator asks the first question, the room is already sending a message.
In this episode, Bob and Joyce explore one of organizational development's most overlooked leadership tools: the physical setup of a meeting.

Do tables create comfort—or barriers? What happens when sixty people—from store managers who are rarely invited into these conversations to district managers, directors, and specialists—leave the rows behind and sit knee-to-knee in one large circle?

The answer is more than a different seating arrangement. It changes the conversation. No hiding in the back. No "head table." No privileged voices. Just one team, sharing one space.

Joyce shares practical ways to use geography as a learning tool—moving people instead of just talking to them, presenting from the floor instead of behind a podium, and even asking people to move their chairs closer together or farther apart to physically demonstrate agreement, disagreement, or alignment.

The lesson is simple but powerful: sometimes people learn more from what they experience than from what they hear. The room itself becomes the teacher.

Changing the room changes the conversation—and often changes the people in it.

Today, we take on a difficult conversation sparked by the tragic killing in Biddeford, Maine, and other deeply disturbing events that have unfolded in recent months. Beyond the individual tragedies is something even more troubling: a growing tendency to normalize horrific, immoral, and dehumanizing behavior.

We see it in our politics. We see it in our communities. We see it in the way people talk about—and sometimes treat—one another. And when that behavior becomes normalized, we risk losing our ability to recognize just how wrong it is.

As OD and HR practitioners, we are at choice. Do we simply get caught in the current of toxic behavior and cultures, quietly adapting to what has become "normal"? Or do we have the courage to call it what it is?

What is our responsibility when the world around us becomes increasingly toxic? How do we create organizations where humanity, dignity, respect, and psychological safety aren't just words on a wall—but values we actively defend?

And maybe this isn't just an HR or OD issue. Maybe it starts with all of us—in the small choices we make every day. A little more curiosity. A little less judgment. An act of kindness toward a stranger. A decision to see the person in front of us as a human being, even when we disagree.

We can't fix everything that's wrong in the world. But perhaps we can influence the spaces we occupy, the cultures we create, and the way we treat the people we encounter.

Maybe that's where change begins.

In this episode, we uncover one of Joyce's most unusual leadership tools—her famous paper plate journals. (Yes, we'll explain.) Over the years, Joyce captured hard-earned insights about what great HR really looks like, jotting them down on paper plates that became her personal leadership playbook.

Together, we revisit those notes as Joyce shares her practical "rules of the road" for HR professionals. Bob, seeing many of them for the first time, reacts in real time, sparking the kind of candid conversation listeners have come to expect.

These aren't theories you'll find in academic textbooks or the latest HR workshop. They're lessons forged through decades of experience—practical, timeless, and surprisingly relevant for anyone leading people today.

And why paper plates? Joyce discovered they were more durable, more portable, and far more coffee- and sweat-proof than a legal pad. Sometimes the best ideas begin in the most unexpected places.

What can today's leaders learn from the bold experiment that created American democracy 250 years ago? Joyce explores the Constitution as an enduring lesson in leadership, systems thinking, and the power of constructive disagreement.

Looking through the lens of organizational development, she explores the Constitution as one of history's most audacious leadership experiments—a bold attempt to design a nation where power is shared, disagreement is expected, and progress depends on conversation rather than conquest. I

t's a timely reminder that democracy, like every healthy organization, isn't self-sustaining. It requires courage, compromise, and people willing to keep coming back to the table.

In today’s episode, Joyce shares an essay she wrote back in 2019 entitled, Maine Voices: In time of turmoil, let’s recommit to our grand democratic experiment.

In today’s episode, we revisit the work of Peter Drucker, widely considered the father of modern management. Drawing from his book, The Daily Drucker, we share several insights that have profound implications for organization development and human resources. While Drucker is often remembered as a business guru and management consultant, his writings are filled with practical wisdom about people, purpose, effectiveness, and leadership.

This is our second visit to Drucker’s work because his ideas continue to challenge us to think differently about organizations and what it really means to get the right things done. If you’re an OD or HR practitioner looking for timeless principles that still speak powerfully to today’s workplace realities, this episode is for you.

Some ideas don’t age. Drucker’s observations from decades ago may be exactly what today’s leaders need to hear.

In today's episode, Bob shares a list he developed of the conditions that help accelerate cultural change in today's fast-paced environment. The list isn't based on theory or the latest management fad. It's drawn from his experience observing what was present when organizational change moved quickly—and actually stuck.

Joyce adds her perspective, and the sparks begin to fly when she admits her instinctive resistance to change happening too quickly. She also argues that Organizational Development carries an important responsibility: setting the thermostat for change by helping create the conditions where meaningful change can take root, grow, and endure.
The conversation explores the tension between speed and sustainability. Along the way, Bob and Joyce discover that some surprisingly simple actions can have an outsized impact on successful change.

As a teaser, here are a few items from Bob's list:
• Be grounded in the business. Understand how work really gets done, not just how it appears on an organization chart.
• Have an OD presence where decisions are made. The OD practitioner serves as a trusted thought partner to the CEO and senior leadership team.
• Engage a vertical slice of the organization. Involve people from different levels and functions to assess readiness for change and provide feedback as the change unfolds.

Join us as we explore what it really takes to accelerate change without sacrificing the conditions that make it sustainable. You may discover that the "secret ingredients" are less about sophisticated change models and more about a handful of practical choices that leaders make every day.

In this episode, we use a bit of lateral thinking to explore a provocative question: What can organizations learn from healthy families?

Joyce introduces a list of characteristics commonly found in healthy families, and together we examine how these traits might apply to organizational culture. Which qualities translate well to the workplace? Where do the parallels break down? And where might seemingly positive family values create unintended consequences?

Many of us cringe when leaders describe their company as "a family." While the phrase can evoke warmth, belonging, and mutual support, it can also signal blurred boundaries, favoritism, unhealthy loyalty, or expectations that employees put the organization's needs ahead of their own.

With that tension as our backdrop, we dive into a lively conversation about the traits of healthy families and what they might teach us about creating healthier, more human workplaces. The discussion led us to some conclusions that surprised even us.

Join us and see where the conversation takes you.

In today’s episode, we wrestle with a tension many OD practitioners quietly carry: wanting our work to matter without wanting to be the center of attention.

Much of what we do happens behind the scenes — coaching leaders, shaping conversations, diffusing conflict, and helping teams succeed in ways that are often invisible to others. When things go well, the leader or team rightfully gets the credit. In many ways, that’s exactly how OD work is supposed to work.

But if we’re honest, there are moments when the lack of acknowledgment can sting. At the same time, many of us feel uncomfortable when the spotlight turns our way. We deflect praise, minimize our contributions, or almost cringe when recognition comes too directly.

So what is this tension really about? Is it humility? Professional identity? Ego? Or simply the complicated reality of doing work that is deeply relational, highly influential, and often hard to see?

In this conversation, we explore the quiet paradox of OD work: helping others shine while remaining mostly invisible ourselves — and the mixed emotions that come with that role.

In this episode, we dive into the provocative assertion by W. Warner Burke that much of today’s change management work is not truly Organizational Development.

That may sound surprising. After all, many OD practitioners spend much of their time helping organizations navigate change. So how could change management not be OD?
As we explore Burke’s perspective, we find ourselves agreeing that his argument has more merit than many might initially think.

At the center of the debate is the idea that much of modern change management — particularly as practiced by large consulting firms such as Deloitte and McKinsey & Company — tends to focus heavily on implementation, project plans, communications strategies, training rollouts, and adoption metrics. While these approaches may improve execution, Burke argues they often lack the deeper human and systemic foundations that have traditionally defined OD.

Joyce and Bob reflect on examples from their own consulting work where change efforts were grounded in core OD principles. Rather than rushing to implementation, they describe the importance of first diagnosing what is really happening in the organization — understanding the culture, relationships, dynamics, and underlying patterns driving behavior.

They also explore how effective OD-based change relies on collaboration, co-creation, participation, and leveraging an understanding of human behavior to build solutions with people rather than imposing solutions on them. In their experience, sustainable change happens not simply through execution discipline, but through engaging the organization in meaningful ways that create ownership, trust, learning, and commitment.

Whether you are an OD practitioner, consultant, leader, or someone trying to help organizations change effectively, this episode challenges us to rethink what meaningful organizational change really requires.

In this episode, we explore a powerful—and often overlooked—opportunity: the workplace as a source of stability in an increasingly unstable world.

At a time when the outside environment feels chaotic, divisive, and uncertain, people are craving something deeply human—connection, meaning, and a sense of belonging. Isolation is more common than we admit, and the pull toward like-minded tribes is growing stronger.
That’s where work can step in—not just as a place to perform tasks, but as a place to feel grounded.

We talk about how leaders and organizations can intentionally create workplaces that offer psychological safety in a noisy world, real community (not just collaboration), and a shared sense of purpose that rises above the daily grind.

This isn’t about making work soft. It’s about making it steady—predictable in the best ways, and human at its core.

Because when done well, the workplace can become something rare today: an island of sanity.

Jump in with us as we explore the question, “What if the most stabilizing force in someone’s life right now… is their job?”

In this episode, we take the timeless insights of Peter Drucker and ask a simple question: what should HR and OD actually do with them?

Drawing from The Daily Drucker, we focus on a few ideas that still hit hard. First, the purpose of any organization is to create a customer—so if HR isn’t helping the business win externally, it’s missing the point.

We also challenge the overused idea that culture “just happens.” Drucker’s thinking pushes OD to shape the daily behaviors that drive results—not just talk about them.

Then there’s accountability. Drucker saw management as a discipline. For HR, that means stepping beyond support roles and helping leaders make better, tougher decisions.

And finally, focus. In a world of endless initiatives, Drucker’s message is clear: do fewer things that matter—and do them well.

This isn’t about quoting Drucker. It’s about applying him—and pressure-testing where his ideas still hold up, and where they might fall short.

In this lightning-round conversation, Bob and Joyce explore leadership through the lens of gender—challenging common assumptions about how men and women tend to lead.

Do women naturally lean more collaborative? Are men more decisive—or just perceived that way? And how much of what we call “gendered leadership style” is real pattern versus outdated stereotype?

With honesty, curiosity, and humor, they reflect on what they’ve seen across years of working with leaders. Along the way, they surface where gender-based generalizations can be useful—and where they quietly limit how we see people and performance.

This isn’t about defining how men or women lead. It’s about noticing the patterns we default to, and asking what becomes possible when we look beyond them.

In this episode, we tackle a blind spot in organizational development: the physical workspace. While HR and OD leaders spend countless hours shaping culture, engagement, and strategy, the environment people work in is often left to architects, facilities, or finance.

That’s a miss.

The spaces people walk into every day send powerful signals about what matters—collaboration or isolation, energy or exhaustion, inclusion or hierarchy. Workspace isn’t just about aesthetics; it directly influences behavior, productivity, and how people feel at work.

We also take on the ongoing debate around open workspaces. Do they actually foster collaboration—or do they create distraction and disengagement? The answer isn’t one-size-fits-all, and that’s exactly why OD needs to be part of the conversation—bringing intention to how space aligns with the work being done.

We explore why OD should have a seat at the table when workplaces are designed or redesigned, and how even small shifts in layout, flow, and intention can create more welcoming and productive environments.

Because culture doesn’t just live in values and conversations—it lives in the walls, the light, and the space between people.

In this episode, we draw a clear line between real Organization Development and work that just looks productive.

Too often, OD starts with tools, processes, and “best practices”—without ever getting clear on the purpose behind them. The result? A lot of activity… and not much impact.

We break it down simply:
The Why – increasing organizational effectiveness and health
The How – the tools and processes used to get there

Most teams start with the How. That’s the problem.

Using performance management as an example, we explore why traditional approaches fall flat—despite all the effort—and why more than two-thirds of employees see reviews as a waste of time.

We’ll share a different approach we’ve used—one that starts with Why and actually drives results.

If your OD work feels busy but not effective, this episode will help you refocus on what really matters.

In this episode, we take on a hard truth: sometimes the very people trained to help organizations—OD practitioners—end up getting in the way.

Great facilitation isn’t about executing a perfect plan. It’s about reading the room, adjusting in real time, and having the courage to do what the moment actually requires. And if we’re honest, that’s where things can go sideways.

We unpack a few common “OD traps” that can quietly derail impact:
• Confusion about our role in the moment—are we facilitating, advising, or leading?
• Sticking to the plan when the room is telling us to pivot
• Creating dependency instead of building capability
• Letting our expertise turn into needing to be the smartest person in the room

This isn’t about beating ourselves up—it’s about getting better.
Because doing good OD work takes more than tools and frameworks. It takes awareness, humility, and the willingness to let go of getting it “right” in favor of doing what’s actually needed.

If you’ve ever walked out of a session thinking, “That didn’t land the way I hoped,” this conversation is for you.

In this episode, we continue our conversation about the role of Organization Development in unsettled times. Last time we explored what it means to act hopeful when it’s hard to feel hopeful. This time we go a step further: How do you show up when things feel uncertain—and still make a positive difference?

We draw inspiration from Margaret Wheatley’s book Who Do We Choose To Be?, which offers a powerful historical perspective on how societies and systems evolve—and what that might mean for the world we’re navigating today.

If we understand these patterns, leaders and OD practitioners can better assess what is actually happening around them—and more importantly, decide how they want to respond.
In our conversation we explore the practical ways leaders can show up in difficult moments:
• Strengthening connection when people feel fragmented
• Choosing love over fear in how we lead
• Maintaining a willingness to contribute, even when outcomes are uncertain
• And yes—keeping a sense of humor along the way

Because in challenging times, leadership isn’t about waiting for optimism.
It’s about generating it.

Let’s be honest.
The world feels a little nuts right now.
Divided. Loud. Unsettled. Tired.
And organizations don’t exist outside of that. They absorb it.

So in this episode, we ask a simple but uncomfortable question:
What does OD need to be when the world feels like it’s coming apart?
And maybe even harder…
How do we act hopeful when we don’t always feel hopeful ourselves?
That’s not fluff. That’s leadership.

Instead of offering grand theories, we get practical.

We suggest starting here:
Stop trying to fix everything. Start by finding the energy.
In every organization — even the messy ones — there are pockets of good energy. People who still care. Teams that still want to build something better. Conversations that feel constructive instead of draining.

If you think in systems, you know this is true.
OD’s job?
Go find that energy.
Name it.
Amplify it.
Build from it.

We also talk about diagnosing energy instead of just diagnosing problems. Ask:
• Where do people feel most alive?
• Where do meetings feel productive?
• Where is there momentum — even if it’s small?

Energy is data.

And then we double down on participation. Because when people help shape the way forward, they create the hope they’re looking for. Participation isn’t soft. It’s catalytic.
We close with a practical exercise inspired by Power vs. Force by David Hawkins — a simple way to surface the life-giving energies (like courage and willingness) versus the draining ones (like fear and blame) that may be shaping your culture more than you realize.
Consider this episode another tool for your toolkit.

Not because we have all the answers.
But because in chaotic times, OD isn’t just about alignment and strategy.
It’s about stewarding energy.

And if OD can’t create hope…
Who will?

What if the biggest obstacle in your organization isn’t resistance — but thinking?

In this episode, Bob ’n Joyce explore why smart leaders keep applying logical, linear solutions to problems that require something different. Drawing on the work of Edward de Bono and his ideas on lateral thinking, we examine why better analysis doesn’t always produce better outcomes.

True creativity — the kind that shifts culture and unlocks strategy — happens when leaders deliberately disrupt their own patterns of thought. That doesn’t come naturally. It takes structure, intention, and often a skilled OD practitioner willing to redirect the conversation sideways.

We share practical ways to apply these concepts in your organization, including how to:
• Interrupt entrenched thinking
• Expand options before narrowing them
• Facilitate conversations that create possibility instead of reinforcing positions

If you’re an OD professional or executive leader, this conversation may challenge how you approach your next strategic discussion.

Sometimes progress doesn’t require more effort.

It requires a different question.

If your leadership team defines culture by your values statement, engagement scores, or what you wish were true — you don’t know your culture.

You’re describing your aspirations.

In this episode, Bob ’n Joyce challenge leaders and OD practitioners to stop treating culture like a slogan and start treating it like a system.

Using a disciplined lateral thinking methodology, they show how to uncover what really drives behavior — the unwritten rules, the workarounds, the quiet power dynamics, and the habits that get rewarded and repeated. Not the culture on the wall. The culture in motion.

Why does this matter? Because culture determines how decisions actually get made. It shapes who advances, what gets funded, what gets tolerated, and what quietly dies.

Strategy doesn’t fail because it’s flawed.
It fails because culture wins.

Lateral thinking offers an indirect, disruptive way to see your organization as it actually operates — not as you’ve convinced yourself it does. And once you can see it clearly, you can lead it intentionally.

Because whether you define it or not, your culture is defining you.

If you’re in OD or a leadership role, chances are your 2026 priorities already look familiar—and that might be the problem.

In this episode, Bob and Joyce unpack what a group of seasoned OD practitioners believe must be at the center of OD and leadership attention in the year ahead. Some of the themes will feel like the usual suspects. Others—especially the growing influence of AI—push against comfortable assumptions about how OD creates value.

Rather than offering a tidy checklist, this conversation invites a harder look. Where is your organization genuinely making progress—and where are you telling yourselves a reassuring story? As you listen, you’re encouraged to ask a deceptively simple question: What are we actually focused on, and why?

While OD has evolved in tools, language, and scope, its core mission hasn’t changed: sustaining the health of the organization as a living system. The real challenge for OD leaders today isn’t knowing everything that matters—it’s deciding what matters most given the realities you’re facing.

To ground the conversation, Joyce shares how a leadership development program she created at Delhaize—Leadership College—directly addressed all six focus areas discussed in the episode, offering a concrete example of what intentional, system-level OD can look like in practice.

Come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome!

It’s January—the season of clean closets, organized drawers, and freshly emptied garages. In this episode, Bob ’n Joyce look beyond the annual cleanup ritual to ask a more interesting question: Does decluttering actually change anything, or does it just make us feel productive for a while?

Yes, clearing clutter feels good. It can be energizing and even cathartic. But as we explore, the real value of decluttering—whether in our personal lives or in organizations—doesn’t come from an occasional burst of cleaning. It comes from making decluttering a deliberate, ongoing practice.

When clutter builds up—physical, mental, or organizational—it often goes unnoticed until it slows us down or gums up the system. Done well, decluttering releases energy, sharpens focus, and clears the way for a fresh start by helping us see what truly matters.

Some takeaways from today’s conversation:
• Decluttering feels good, but it can also postpone work on what matters most.
• One-time cleanups offer short-term relief; the benefits rarely last.
• A daily cadence of doing just two things that genuinely make a difference may be far more powerful than an occasional cleanup surge.

Individuals and organizations both benefit from clearing the clutter that slows them down. The challenge is that clutter often hides in plain sight. For leaders and OD practitioners, the work is learning to see it—and engaging people in periodically clearing the air so real progress can happen.

So let’s get to it.
Come on in.
Grab a snack.
Welcome.

In today’s episode, Bob ’n Joyce take on a question many organizations avoid—but can’t afford to ignore: What does the business actually need from its leaders right now?

Rather than defaulting to generic competency models or last year’s leadership playbook, Joyce pulls from her flip-chart archives—capturing real-world leadership “must-haves” identified by two distinct groups: the C-suite and Operations VPs working in the trenches.
What emerges is a fascinating contrast between strategic expectations and operational realities—from leading large-scale change and building long-term capacity, to battle-hardened confidence, simplicity of mindset, and spending more time in the field than the office.

Bob ’n Joyce then force-rank the top three leadership attributes from each group and invite you to do the same. Why? Because leadership development without context is just activity—not impact.

Given the challenges your organization faces this year, this episode helps you make a conscious, strategic choice about where to focus leadership development so it serves the business—not just the curriculum.

Come on in.
Grab a snack.
Welcome.

Footnote: Leadership Attributes Identified by Each Group
C-suite Leadership “Must-Haves”
• Proven track record
• Builds capacity
• High energy endurance
• Vision for strategy
• Inspires
• Compassionate
• Courageous
• Builds productive relationships
• Leads large change
• Keeps the long-term good of the company in mind

Operations VP Leadership “Must-Haves”
• Passionate and curious
• Battle-hardened confidence
• Team smarts (collaborative)
• Simple mindset (ultimate sophistication)
• Fearlessness (no comfort in comfort)
• Preparation and patience
• Time management
• Smart interviewing
• More time out of the office than in
• The art of running meetings

What happens when you slow down, ask better questions, and resist the urge to rush to answers? In this episode, Bob ’n Joyce model a real-time reflection that sparks insight, tension, and surprising clarity for the year ahead.

Using curiosity and inquiry, they pose a series of powerful questions to one another—questions designed to disrupt familiar thinking and generate fresh insights and “aha” moments.

What unfolds is a candid, in-the-moment assessment of their current reality, paired with the creative tension between where they are today and what they hope for in the year ahead. You’ll hear the pauses, the uncertainty, and the less-than-polished responses that come with doing this work honestly.

Fair warning: this is not an easy or comfortable exercise. But it is a meaningful one. The rewards of slowing down, asking better questions, and reflecting together—whether with a team or across an entire organization—are well worth the effort.

Come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome!

In today’s episode, Bob ‘n Joyce reflect on the start of a new year and the importance of pausing to renew and reset our intentions. Many of us begin January with resolutions to improve our health, habits, and overall well-being. Thoughtful organizations do the same—taking time to reflect on what’s working, what’s not, and what truly needs to change.

In organizational development, this process is often called a reset. Bob ‘n Joyce explore one proven methodology—the Future Search Conference—that helps teams and organizations step back, make sense of their current reality, and align around a shared and preferred future.

Why does a structured approach to an organizational reset matter? Because good intentions alone rarely lead to lasting change. Most personal New Year’s resolutions fade by Valentine’s Day, and organizational change efforts face the same risk—many stall, lose momentum, or fall short of their goals.

Whether you’re setting personal intentions for 2026 or leading a team that needs a thoughtful reset, this episode offers practical insights to help turn reflection into meaningful action.

Come on in. Grab a healthy snack. You’re welcome here.

In this episode, Bob ’n Joyce explore key findings from Gallup’s 2025 World Happiness Report. The United States experienced a notable decline, ranking 24th — its lowest position ever. The report highlights how social connection, financial wellbeing, emotional health, and physical wellness all play a critical role in overall happiness.

While these findings may not come as a surprise, they should serve as a wake-up call for business leaders and OD practitioners. Unhappy employees don’t just affect morale — they impact business results and workplace culture in very real ways.

In the spirit of the season, we focus on what we can do to address chronic unhappiness, drawing directly from insights in the Gallup poll. What emerges are solutions that don’t require big budgets or more time. In fact, small, subtle shifts by leaders — being fully present, asking thoughtful questions, and helping people feel seen and validated — can make a meaningful difference.

On a personal level, we invite you, our listeners, to use this holiday season as a moment to pause, look around, and make someone’s day. Kindness is contagious — and when it spreads, it lifts all of us.

No better time to begin than now.

Come on in, grab a snack. Welcome!

In today’s episode, Bob ’n Joyce unpack an article Joyce wrote years ago on a powerful OD technique she used to assess organizational wellness. Culture can feel fuzzy and hard to diagnose, but this simple inquiry tool makes it concrete, practical, and actionable for leaders, coaches, and OD practitioners.

You’ll hear when this tool is most valuable—such as during a leadership transition, when performance is slipping, or when an organization has lost its competitive edge—and then we walk through the roadmap step by step.

Joyce’s Diagnostic Roadmap Includes:

Getting a Balcony Perspective

What’s causing the distress? What internal contradictions does that distress reveal? What is the history behind those contradictions? What perspectives or interests do I (or others) now represent that may be in conflict? How might we, as a team or organization, be mirroring these broader dynamics?

Identifying the Tolerable Range of Distress

How do we typically respond to disequilibrium—confusion, conflict, external threats, shifting roles? When in the past has distress escalated to a breaking point? What actions have senior leaders traditionally used to restore equilibrium, and what can I influence now?

Patterns of Work and Work Avoidance

What work and work-avoidance patterns are showing up? What do these patterns reveal about the real adaptive challenge? What clues do leaders (often unintentionally) provide? Which issues are ripe for action—and which may need ripening?

There’s a lot to unwrap (pun fully intended), so settle in, grab a healthy snack, and join us for a lively conversation on diagnosing culture in a way that actually helps organizations heal and grow.

In today’s episode, Bob ‘n Joyce are joined by Alfredo Borodowski for an energizing and insightful conversation on positivity, resilience, purpose, and happiness. Alfredo takes us on a journey through the evolution of positive psychology—from its early days 25 years ago to today—showing how the science of positivity can transform people and organizations.

Alfredo’s passion for human fulfillment and doing good is a much-needed message in today’s world. One of his great gifts is making the complex simple and the abstract concrete and actionable. He also shares his personal struggle with mental illness and how that challenge revealed his life’s purpose.

Grab a pen and notebook—this episode is packed with practical ideas you can use immediately.’

A Sample of Today’s Conversation
• The 24 character strengths at the core of what motivates each of us.
• Why understanding and applying your signature strengths makes you nine times more likely to achieve fulfillment and high performance.
• How purpose, pleasure, and strengths intersect to unlock full potential.
• Why objectives end but purpose never does.
• A simple definition of purpose: Giving the best of yourself for the benefit of others.
• The Purpose Factor—an assessment that provides a 50-page personalized description of your life’s purpose.
• The four factors companies need to thrive in the future: self-confidence, hope, optimism, and resilience (also known as Psychological Capital).

About Our Guest
Alfredo Borodowski, PhD, MSW, is an organizational consultant and positive psychology expert who has devoted his career to guiding organizations through profound cultural shifts. He brings practical, immediately applicable strategies to every engagement.

Alfredo's Upcoming Book: The Human Upgrade: The New Resilient Leadership for Peak Performance in the AI Revolution
In this powerful new book, Alfredo Borodowski shows how individuals, teams, and entire organizations can thrive—rather than just survive—amid rapid technological change. Day-to-day routines, AI-driven disruption, global uncertainty: all turn into opportunities when you harness clarity, purpose, resilience, and mental focus. Through real stories, neuroscience-informed practices, and practical exercises, The Human Upgrade offers a roadmap for building adaptive minds, purposeful workplaces, and high-performing lives. It’s for athletes, executives, creators — anyone who wants to turn pressure into possibility.
Expected release: early 2026 (pre-order available at positiveab.com).

In this episode, Bob ‘n Joyce explore how the words we think and speak shape the world we live in. Our language can either unlock new possibilities or quietly reinforce the status quo. And in a world that’s often dripping with negativity, it’s easy to get swept up and mirror the tone around us. The same dynamic plays out inside organizations: the prevailing language can propel a culture forward… or keep it stuck.

Key Takeaways:
• Choosing our words consciously — what we call activating language — can bring new possibilities into being that wouldn’t emerge on their own.
• The words we use about ourselves influence how we show up and how others experience us.
• Most of us toss out language without realizing its impact.
• The dominant language inside an organization is a direct signal of the health of its culture.

Join us as we unpack how language shapes personal and organizational wellbeing.

Come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome!

Today, Bob ’n Joyce welcome Bernie Youngblood — a force of nature who brings passion, candor, and a deep sense of purpose to everything he touches. A self-described “accidental entrepreneur,” Bernie has launched eight companies, reinvented industries, and built a career anchored in one simple belief: doing good and doing well should go hand-in-hand.

Bernie doesn’t dodge hard questions. In fact, he runs straight at them. In this conversation, he challenges conventional thinking and offers a perspective that every leader — from scrappy founders to seasoned execs — needs to hear.

We cover a wide terrain, including:
• The biggest mistake startup CEOs make
• Why the world needs more people willing to speak truth to power
• Why it’s never just about the money
• How organizations can win by putting purpose, wellness, and culture first
• The myth of scarcity
• Staying hopeful in chaotic times

Bernie is a provocateur in the best sense — someone who shakes people awake, pushes for better, and reminds us that leadership is ultimately about impact.

Here we go. Come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome.

About Our Guest
Bernie Youngblood is an 8x founder, CEO, marketer, and change agent who helps organizations win by putting purpose, wellness, and culture at the center of their strategy. After starting his career in finance, Bernie found his true calling in sales, marketing, and entrepreneurship — leading national campaigns, driving corporate spin-offs, building startups from the ground up, and helping Fortune 500 companies rethink how they go to market.

Today, he splits his time between two missions: transforming workplace wellness as Director of Partnerships at HOTLOGIC®, and leading ThinkPartners, a boutique firm that connects for-profits, nonprofits, and artist communities to ignite purpose-driven growth. He also hosts Unboxing the Office, a podcast exploring corporate culture with honesty and humor.

Bernie’s work is rooted in a simple conviction: thriving people build thriving companies.

In today’s episode, Bob ‘n Joyce dive into the pitfalls that often accompany the perceived benefits of outsourcing HR services. While outsourcing can seem like a smart move, especially on paper, it often brings unintended consequences—many of them negative—despite the best intentions and solid rationale.

We’re not anti-outsourcing, but we’ve seen the chaos that can result when the process isn’t managed well. The good news? With the right approach, much of that chaos can be avoided.

Here are a few of our thoughts on making outsourcing work for you rather than against you:
• Pain points are inevitable with any major change—but a thoughtful process can minimize them.
• When the primary rationale is purely financial, that’s often a recipe for trouble.
• If the risk-reward stakes are high, start small: a pilot phase can be a powerful learning tool.
So come on in, grab a snack, and join us for a candid conversation about how to keep outsourcing from turning into an out-of-control adventure.

In today’s episode, Bob ‘n Joyce welcome Bishop Kevin Foreman — a powerhouse of purpose, energy, and impact. A success coach, author, philanthropist, entrepreneur, and founding Pastor of Harvest Church, Bishop Foreman has spent his life helping people rise above their circumstances and lead with intention.

From the moment the conversation starts, it’s clear Bishop Foreman sees leadership not as a title, but as the art of developing people and building cultures where others can thrive. Drawing on his experience leading both faith-based and entrepreneurial organizations, he shares practical wisdom on aligning vision, purpose, and performance — with humor, humility, and heart.

From his roots in Orange Mound, Memphis, to creating a dynamic movement that blends spiritual growth with personal and organizational transformation, Bishop’s story is a masterclass in how leadership can shape lives and communities.
Get ready for a high-energy, high-impact conversation that will leave you inspired to live — and lead — with purpose.

Come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome!

Guest Bio:

Known as “The People’s Bishop,” Bishop Kevin Foreman is the founding Pastor of Harvest Church, a success coach, author, and philanthropist dedicated to helping people and organizations reach their potential. From humble beginnings in Orange Mound, Memphis, he built a movement centered on transformation and wholeness. He is also the founder and chancellor of Harvest Bible College and the creator of #FitHarvest, a wellness initiative encouraging people to live in “shalom” — where nothing is missing, nothing is lacking, and all is well.

In today’s episode, Bob ‘n Joyce welcome Steve Jaffe, author of The Layoff Journey: From Dismissal to Discovery, for a powerful conversation about turning job loss into personal growth. Steve shares lessons from his 22-year journey through multiple layoffs—how his early struggles gave way to resilience and insight over time.

His book guides readers through the stages of grief that often follow a layoff and offers practical tools for navigating job searches and interviews with renewed confidence. Together, we explore how layoffs reveal the true values and culture of an organization—a theme we’ve revisited often (most recently in Episode 189, Letting Employees Go – Do It Right or Pay the Price).

Come on in. Grab a snack. Let’s talk about how to handle one of the toughest transitions in work and life—with honesty, compassion, and purpose.

About Steve Jaffe
Steve Jaffe brings 25 years of advertising and marketing expertise and deep experience with career transitions into his consulting practice. As the author of The Layoff Journey and a seasoned executive who worked on the iconic “What Happens in Vegas, Stays in Vegas” campaign, Steve offers unique insights into professional perseverance, rebuilding after sudden change, and authentic leadership.

Connect with Steve:
📧 steve@thestevejaffe.com
🔗 linkedin.com/in/jaffesteve/
📸 instagram.com/stevejaffethelayoffjourney/

Welcome to the Bob 'n Joyce Talk HR 'n OD Podcast.
Meet us, find our why we are doing this podcast, and what our hope is for you, our listeners.
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View more information at www.bobnjoyce.com.

The world feels broken — and so do many workplaces. In this episode, Bob ’n Joyce explore how a systems-based approach to Organization Development can help leaders respond with intention. When uncertainty and disruption are the norm, creating safe spaces where people feel seen, heard, and supported isn’t optional — it’s essential. Together, they unpack how OD principles equip leaders to build trust, foster connection, and create the conditions where people and organizations can truly thrive.

Join our safe space. Come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome!

In this episode, Bob ’n Joyce sit down with Rita Ramakrishnan, executive coach and neurodivergent leadership expert. Rita shares her passion for working with neurodivergent leaders, along with her own story of being diagnosed with ADHD and autism as an adult.

Highlights from the conversation:
• How neurodivergent leaders can identify and leverage their unique strengths while creating strategies to navigate challenges—building a sense of cognitive ease.
• Why supportive communities and structures matter when living with ADHD.
• Examples of ADHD in the workplace—ranging from challenges like inattention and hyper-focus to strengths such as creativity and pattern recognition.
• The power of reframing clients’ experiences as strengths rather than burdens.

Rita’s openness, wisdom, and intuition shine as she shares both personal and professional stories that demonstrate her impact as a business leader and coach.

About Rita:
Rita brings 15 years of experience driving leadership development, behavioral change, and transformation across organizations of all sizes. She has served as a fractional Chief People Officer in startups, aligning people strategies with business goals.
She completed her leadership coaching training at Georgetown University, holds a team coaching certification from Brown University, and is pursuing a Master’s at the University of Pennsylvania focused on coaching modalities for neurodivergent leaders.
Rita is the founder of IKSANA Consulting, a coaching and human capital solutions practice.

🔗 Learn more: https://www.iksana.com

In this episode, Bob ’n Joyce call out those pushy political solicitations — the emails and texts that try to guilt or scare you into giving your time, talent, or money. Annoying? Absolutely. But there’s a bigger lesson here: organizations often use the same tactics when trying to win employee support.

Too many leaders skip the hard work of real dialogue and rely on one-way pitches. The result? Resistance, eye-rolls, and lost momentum.

Bob ’n Joyce share real examples of what works instead: “tilling the soil” through patience, active listening, and co-creating possibilities. The bottom line? Support isn’t something you force — it’s something you grow.

So Please come join us and don’t forget your snack or comforting drink.

In this Labor Day episode, Bob ’n Joyce shine a spotlight on the blue-collar heroes who keep our communities and organizations running. These men and women bring grit, skill, and pride to their work—whether they’re building, fixing, driving, or keeping the lights on. Too often their contributions are overlooked, yet without them the systems we rely on every day simply wouldn’t function.

We step back to honor the dignity of all work—not just what happens in corner offices or behind computer screens. Every paycheck, every community, every thriving business stands on the shoulders of people whose names we may not know, but whose impact we feel everywhere.

As OD and HR professionals, we have a responsibility to create cultures that celebrate, respect, and support these workers. Join us for a heartfelt conversation about why blue-collar work matters, what we can learn from it, and how we can give these unsung heroes the recognition they deserve.

So, grab a snack, pull up a chair, and let’s raise a toast to the backbone of our workplaces and our lives.

In this episode, Bob ’n Joyce share the hard-earned principles that helped their OD work actually stick. Too often, change efforts fail because the “rules of the road” are ignored. In past conversations, we may have made OD sound smooth and effortless — but the truth is, most of the tough work was anything but easy.

From preparing the ground before diving in to remembering that “thick skin” is essential, these guidelines come from lessons learned the hard way:
• Till the soil before leaping in
• Never underestimate the value of a good warm-up
• When in doubt, stop and check in with the group
• Drop “right” and “wrong” from your vocabulary
• Spend two-thirds of your time serving, which earns you one-third to push back
• Never assume you know better
• Grow some thick skin

Whether you’re leading your next leadership meeting or tackling a major change initiative, these rules will help smooth the road and improve your odds of success.

So come on in, grab a snack, and let’s hit the road together.

In this episode, Bob ’n Joyce explore the surprising benefits of resistance to change. Too often, resistance is seen as a problem to squash — but that only fuels it further. Instead, what if resistance is a signal worth listening to?

When we meet resistance with curiosity and inquiry, it becomes a powerful ally for successful change. Resistance is natural. It’s the system’s way of saying, “Not so fast.”
This conversation was sparked by The Seven C’s of Consulting by Mick Cope — a book we’re reading (and loving).

Here are a few flavors of resistance we dig into:
• Flavor of the day change – “Here we go again…”
• Imposed change – Done to us vs. done with us
• Dislike of surprises – “You’re doing what?”
• Unpopular issues – The hard stuff nobody wants to face
• Fear of the unknown – The imperfect and uncertain
• Feeling inadequate – Not up to the challenge
• Lack of respect – Doubting the messenger

So don’t resist — come on in, grab a snack, and join us for the conversation.

In this episode, Bob ‘n Joyce pick up where they left off in Episode 204, exploring the infectious power of energy. Too often overlooked, energy shapes how we provoke, improve, and influence the people and systems around us. Each of us carries this superpower, capable of sparking positivity—or negativity—based on how we show up.

Every system is in constant flux, driven by the ebb and flow of energy. Today, we share practical ways leaders and OD practitioners can harness this invisible force to elevate individuals, teams, and entire organizations. It begins with learning to see energy at work, everywhere and all the time.

Tune in for an energy boost that’s guaranteed to lift your day!

In this episode, Bob ’n Joyce tap into the invisible but undeniable power of energy. What happens when we look at organizations — and even society — through the lens of energy? We see opportunities that are too often overlooked.

Fresh from a week-long immersion in healing energy at the Omega Institute, Joyce shares her big takeaway: blocked energy is everywhere, stifling creativity and slowing momentum. The challenge — and opportunity — for HR, OD, and all leaders is clear: unleash energy so people and organizations don’t just get by, but thrive.

Join us as we explore how to tap into this vital force to spark innovation, build prosperity, and create workplaces (and lives) that flow.

So grab a healthy snack and step into the conversation — the power is all around us.

In this episode, Bob ‘n Joyce shine the spotlight on Joyce and her winding journey to becoming an OD expert. It’s a story filled with unexpected turns, setbacks, resilience, and an unwavering drive to keep moving forward. From a high schooler more interested in socializing and boys to a leader in workplace culture transformation, Joyce shares how each step shaped her path.

Insights from Joyce’s journey:
• The power of knowing your “Why.”
• Trusting others when they point out your unique gifts.
• Accepting that careers are rarely neat or perfectly planned.
• How small choices create big changes over time.
• The courage to say “yes” and leap into discomfort.

Come ready to laugh, reflect, and be inspired by Joyce’s story. So grab some popcorn, pull up a chair, and join the conversation.

In this episode, Bob ‘n Joyce dig into the underrated superpower of knowing before doing. Before charging ahead, what if we paused to truly assess what’s needed? We share a playful, low-tech meeting check-in that opened the door to real talk—and it just might work wonders in your next gathering.

From informal gut checks to formal tools that steer hiring and change management, we explore how assessments help leaders tune in, not just dive in. You’ll also hear a few “ouch” moments when we skipped this step… and paid the price.

So come hang out with us as we assess the art of assessment. Bring your curiosity—and maybe a snack. Welcome in.

In this episode, Bob ‘n Joyce explore a simple yet powerful technique called “I want…”—a way to name our desires and aspirations out loud. As we cross the 200-episode milestone, we turn inward to uncover what we truly want from our work, and in doing so, open up new possibilities.

This candid conversation gets up close and personal, surprising even us with what surfaced. It’s a reminder that we often assume what others want—or even what we want—without asking or expressing it clearly.

The “I want…” exercise is a great tool for teams or families to explore their hopes and goals together. When spoken aloud, doubts give way to clarity and connection.

Bob ‘n Joyce break down how to use this technique at the end of the episode—give it a try and see what opens up!

Come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome!

Today marks a major milestone—our 200th episode! For over four years, we’ve shown up every Tuesday morning, come rain or shine. This ritual has been our anchor, carrying us through both the highs and the lows.

Lately, we’ve been talking a lot about finding an “island of sanity” in turbulent times. In many ways, this podcast has been ours—a space to think, laugh, question, and reconnect.

Here’s what we’re all about:
• Raw honesty and deep curiosity
• Stories that spark fresh thinking
• Celebrating competence and being fully alive
• Humor that helps lighten the load

Today, we raise a toast—to our steadfastness, our friendship, and to you, our listeners. Your support makes all of this possible.

So for the 200th time… come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome!

In this episode, Bob ’n Joyce dive into what it takes for organizations to stay grounded when chaos and uncertainty are no longer the exception—they’re the backdrop. As global and local challenges intensify, leaders face a new mandate: create environments where people can stay resilient, think creatively, and feel safe enough to perform at their best.

We explore:

This is a practical, hopeful conversation about leading with heart and strategy when the world gets wobbly. Grab a snack and come on in—welcome.

In this episode, we sit down with Dr. Michelle Griffin, CEO and founder of Griffin Resources—an entrepreneur who truly has the "right stuff." Whether you're a seasoned business owner or just starting out, Michelle’s story is a masterclass in growing a thriving business without sacrificing your life.

Michelle brings a rare blend of strategic insight and human-centered leadership. She sees the big picture, acts with precision, and knows how to create results—without burning out.

Here’s what you’ll hear in this episode:
• How adaptability—and knowing when to pivot—fuels long-term success
• Why passion and vision are the heartbeat of every great business
• Strategy is key, but hiring the right team is what makes it real
• How being introverted can be a superpower in leadership and connecting

• Michelle’s gift for turning bold ideas into sustainable business models
• Working full throttle and making room for balance, joy, and play

It’s a conversation full of insight, energy, and the kind of honesty that makes you reflect. Get ready to be inspired by Michelle’s journey.

About Michelle Griffin Ph.D.
Michelle is the CEO and founder of Griffin Resources, a firm providing fractional HR support to small and mid-sized companies—both domestic and multinational. She’s PHR and SHRM-CP certified, an industrial-organizational psychologist, and a sought-after speaker. Her expertise spans the full spectrum of HR, from compliance and payroll to M&A, entity creation, and talent strategy.

In this second part of our resiliency deep dive, Bob ‘n Joyce take a close look at MIT Sloan’s latest take on what makes a culture truly resilient. Do we agree with their insights? Mostly. But spoiler alert: we still like our list better.

We break down the key conditions MIT Sloan says drive resiliency and stack them up against our lived experience in the trenches of culture work. The result? A thoughtful, and at times feisty, side-by-side review.

Here’s a taste of what they recommend:
• Flexible work schedules that actually work
• Skill-based approaches to culture change (not more slogans)
• Turning skeptics into champions
• Learning from mistakes—really
• Letting employees shape their own roles
• Prioritizing honesty and psychological safety

We wrap with a call to action: What’s your resiliency playbook?
Come on in, grab a snack, and let’s keep it real.

In this episode, Bob ‘n Joyce dive into how to create and sustain organizational resiliency—a must-have competency in today’s fast-changing business world.

We kick things off with a little game we call “learning.” First, we share our personal and professional takes on what makes a workplace truly resilient. Then, in the next episode, we’ll check in with the experts at MIT Sloan Management Review to see how our perspectives stack up.

Some of the ideas we unpack today:
• Getting real about the challenge
• Community – We are ‘in this’ together
• Focusing on excellence and winning
• Embracing risk—and yes, learning from failure

So grab a snack, pull up a chair, and join the conversation. And hey, we’d love to hear your take on resiliency too.

After we hit “stop” on our last episode, Tight Ship or Jazz Band?, we realized the conversation wasn’t over. The tension between discipline and flexibility kept tugging at us — and stirred up a few stories (and laughs) we hadn’t yet shared.

So we’re back, diving deeper into the power and pitfalls of routine, the magic of improvisation, and why finding that balance matters more than ever in today’s workplace.

In this follow-up episode, Bob ‘n Joyce:
• Unpack why some habits feel safe but may be limiting innovation
• Talk about real-life moments when “flugidity” made all the difference
• Explore how leaders can create cultures that flex without falling apart
• Challenge listeners to reexamine what structure they’re clinging to — and why

Whether you’re running a tight ship or playing in a jazz band, this encore conversation is for anyone trying to lead with more ease, creativity, and courage.

Bob ‘n Joyce riff on how much structure is too much — and when it’s time to improvise.

In this episode, they dive into the ongoing tug-of-war between discipline and flexibility — habits that create stability vs. the adaptability that sparks innovation.

Once upon a time, businesses prized routine, rituals, and predictability. But in today’s fast-moving world, research suggests agility and openness may be even more crucial. So, which is it? The truth may lie somewhere in the messy, magical middle.
In this episode, Bob ‘n Joyce:

• Coin a new word: flugidity – the courage to challenge routines that no longer serve the business
• Reveal how rigid habits and SOPs can create dangerous blind spots
• Explore what’s changed in the workplace to shift the balance toward flexibility
• Talk about the magic of mastering your craft and dancing in the moment

If your weekly ritual includes tuning in to us — well, that’s one habit we fully support. So grab a snack, get comfy, and let’s jump in.

In this episode, Bob ‘n Joyce explore what it really takes to create a workplace where people thrive — and it’s a lot more than free snacks and ping pong tables.

They dive into the idea of on-site wellness centers, where employees can unplug, recharge, and access real support.

Imagine a workplace that offers:
✅ Manicures and massage therapy
✅ On-site counseling for burnout or stress
✅ Flu and COVID shots without leaving the office
✅ Yoga, dance, and meditation sessions

Bob ‘n Joyce make the case that this isn’t a far-out fantasy. Companies like SAS Institute in Cary, NC, have been doing it for over 40 years — and it’s a big reason they consistently rank among the best places to work in America.

Tune in for fresh ideas on how your company can move beyond surface perks and start building a true culture of care.

Come on in, grab a snack, and welcome!

In this episode, Bob ’n Joyce explore the common practice of relying on the same group of people—time and again—to get important work done. Joyce calls them the “spoiled brats,” while Bob refers to them as the “usual suspects” or “chosen ones.”
The problem? This habit unintentionally sidelines the talent in waiting—the wild cards and up-and-comers—who miss out on critical development opportunities. We dive into practical ways to tap the full potential of your organization by broadening access to special projects and growth experiences beyond the usual favorites.

In this episode:
• Eye-opening stories about the surprising success of newbies and wild cards
• A breakdown of a common flaw in talent planning that keeps this pattern alive
• Why hands-on project work often beats traditional training for impact

If your company is stuck picking from the same short list—and it's holding you back—this episode is your wake-up call.

So pull up a chair, grab your favorite snack, and let’s shake things up together.

In today’s episode, Bob ‘n Joyce pick up where they left off in episode 185, diving deeper into how leaders can navigate turbulent and unsettling times with intention and heart. The key? Leaders must first ground themselves before engaging in conversations about what the business needs to move forward.

But how do you get grounded? Where do you start, and with whom? And how can leaders truly support their teams—not just to survive, but to thrive?

Here are a few hints to guide the discussion:
• Start by scanning the environment before jumping into action.
• Never underestimate the power of a meaningful conversation.
• Speak the truth—sugarcoating doesn’t soothe, truth does.
• Counter exhaustion by encouraging play and nurturing the system.

Like episode 185, there are no neat bows here—just real, practical ideas to chew on.

So come on in. Grab a soothing snack or beverage. Welcome!

In this episode, Bob 'n Joyce sit down with someone who really knows how to spark transformation from the inside out—Ernesto Gómez Arzapalo. He’s worn a lot of hats—OD consultant, c-suite exec, academic, serial entrepreneur—and somehow manages to still be one of the nicest guys you’ll ever meet.

Ernesto brings the kind of wisdom you only get from decades in the trenches—leading people-first cultural overhauls for companies with tens of thousands of employees, while also launching his own ventures and guest lecturing at a top-tier business school. We dig into the ideas behind his new book, Regrowth – How Organizations Can Overcome Stalling by Unlocking Their People's Potential, and trust us: this isn’t your typical corporate jargon. Ernesto drops practical, sometimes surprising insights that can help any organization—or individual—get unstuck and thrive.

This convo is full of stories, laughter, and that rare mix of head and heart. You’ll hear how Ernesto helped shift cultures inside massive companies, why unlocking human potential isn’t just HR’s job, and how his journey from Mexico to MIT continues to shape his work and life.

So grab a coffee. Maybe a snack. And come hang out with us—you’ll leave this one with a full brain and a full heart.

🎧 Listen in and learn:
• Why most culture change efforts fall flat—and how to do it differently
• What it really means to lead through ambiguity
• How to move from stuck to thriving (yes, it’s possible)
• Why Ernesto believes in “regrowth,” not just “growth”

✨ Connect with Ernesto:

•Website : aspenmindset1.com
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ernesto-gómez-arzapalo-8783ab43/

In this episode, Bob and Joyce explore the critical importance of handling employee terminations the right way. When done poorly, these moments don’t just affect the individuals involved—they send shockwaves through the entire organization, damaging culture and trust.

The conversation is sparked by the troubling trend of mass layoffs via impersonal emails, as seen recently in the U.S. government. With such cold, transactional approaches becoming more common, are we at risk of normalizing workplace incivility?

While layoffs and terminations are sometimes necessary due to business demands, how they’re handled speaks volumes about an organization's values and leadership. This is where HR and OD professionals must step up to ensure fairness, dignity, and alignment with company culture.

Grab a snack and join us as we dive into this crucial conversation.

In this episode, Bob and Joyce reflect on the evolving role of HR and OD amidst today’s profound global disruptions. Drawing inspiration from Meg Wheatley—author and organizational wellness expert—we explore the concept of creating islands of sanity in a world where many feel isolated, ignored, or overwhelmed. We discuss practical ways to build strong, sustainable work communities that foster possibility, even in the face of chaos and negativity.

About Meg Wheatley’s Book, Who Do We Choose to Be?
“This book is born of my desire to summon leaders in this time of profound disruption—to reclaim leadership as a noble profession that cultivates possibility and humanness in the midst of fear and turmoil.”

The work ahead is not for the faint of heart, but you’re not alone. As your OD partners, we’ll be with you every step of the way.

So come on in, grab a snack, and let’s dive in. Welcome!

In this episode, Bob ‘n Joyce welcome Dr. Rob Lion, a strategist, professor, and expert in workplace culture, leadership development, and performance improvement. With a passion for helping students, business leaders, and HR/OD practitioners grow and thrive, Rob blends academic rigor with real-world experience to create sustainable, high-performance practices.

His consultancy, Black River Performance Management, is built on the philosophy that success comes from applying proven models and strategies—what he calls his tools. As he puts it, “Where science meets practice.”

Join us as Dr. Rob shares insights from 20+ years of experience—what’s worked, what hasn’t, and how organizations can cultivate thriving workplace cultures.

Come on in, grab a snack, and enjoy the conversation!

About Dr. Rob Lion

Dr. Rob Lion is a seasoned expert in human resource development and organizational behavior. As a professor at Idaho State University, he has mentored the next generation of leaders while consulting with executives, business owners, and community leaders to build people-centric, high-performing organizations.
Through Black River Performance Management, Rob helps organizations enhance leadership effectiveness, optimize team performance, and tackle complex workplace challenges. His evidence-based, psychology-driven approach ensures measurable, lasting results.

Interested in how Dr. Rob can support your organization? Get in touch:

🔗 blackriverpm.com/contact

In today’s episode, Bob ‘n Joyce dive into how people react to change—especially in the workplace. If you’re a change agent or work in organizational development, you won’t be surprised by resistance to change. But what may surprise you are the practical steps you can take to minimize chaos and increase the chances of success.

With most organizational changes falling short of their intended benefits, understanding how to navigate resistance is crucial. The key? Recognizing that people respond to change in vastly different ways—there’s no one-size-fits-all approach.

So come on in, grab a snack, and let’s talk about the messy, unpredictable, and sometimes surprising world of change. Welcome!

In this episode, we tackle a conversation we’d rather avoid—but know we must have. How can leaders create the conditions for constructive dialogue in divisive times?

Do they take a stand based on their company’s vision, values, and business needs, even if it alienates some? Or do they stay silent, wary of the risks in today’s political climate?

We don’t claim to have “the” answer, but we do offer ideas on how to:
• Prepare people for difficult conversations.
• Take it slow—without turning it into an initiative or labeling it.
• Act once you’re grounded in what’s real and what the company needs.
• Foster a space for candid, honest dialogue.

No neatly wrapped solutions here—just real talk. We think you’ll enjoy it anyway.

Come on in, grab a snack, and welcome!

In this episode, Bob ‘n Joyce explore the power of deliberate and intentional leadership. Too often, we miss opportunities to maximize our impact by reacting impulsively to the chaos around us. Instead of leading with purpose, we get swept up in the moment.

Leading with intention means consciously choosing our words and actions to shape outcomes rather than merely responding to circumstances. This practice doesn’t come naturally—it requires patience, self-awareness, and the ability to step back and see the bigger picture.

We share real-world examples and practical strategies to help you cultivate intentional leadership in both your professional and personal life. So, are you ready to take control of how you show up as a leader? Join us for this insightful conversation—grab a snack, settle in, and let’s dive in!

In today’s episode, Bob ‘n Joyce welcome Mark Carpenter, author and leadership consultant, to discuss his work helping leaders bring their full humanity to work. Mark’s leadership premise is that there are leadership positions and there are leaders and that the two should not be confused. They may coexist together but too often they don’t. Mark helps front line leaders and executives connect the dots between a healthy business and the way that they lead.

In today’s episode, you will discover:

Come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome!

About Mark Carpenter:

Mark’s passion is helping others achieve more of their potential, and uses his three decades of experience to provide perspective and guidance to others. He loves speaking, facilitating, coaching, consulting in communications, leadership development, motivation, change management, and storytelling as a leadership skill. His Master Storytelling program helps individuals and teams turn their real-life experiences into stories that teach, lead, sell, and inspire. Mark spent 10 years as an adjunct professor in communications, and often spoke at a wide variety of conferences for industries ranging from health care to manufacturing to project management to public relations and more. He is a master certified trainer for Crucial Learning courses: Crucial Conversations for Mastering Dialogue, Crucial Conversations for Accountability, Influencer, and Getting Things Done.

https://www.linkedin.com/in/mark-carpenter-0b55221/

In this episode, Bob ‘n Joyce discuss the findings of a Strategy + Business Newsletter article on the 5 qualities that leaders must possess to succeed in today’s world. These qualities imply a shift from the metrics of efficiency and performance to managing the more intangible aspects of the business such as governance, environmental impact, and a positive work culture.

We muse about the implications of these new qualities on HR/OD and what new leadership models may emerge to guide the next generation. What we know for sure is that what was once linear and concrete about leading is becoming fungible and murky. Welcome to world as we all know it.

For those of you who are interested, here is a link to the article:

https://www.strategy-business.com/article/The-five-new-foundational-qualities-of-effective-leadership

Come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome!

In this episode, Bob’nJoyce talk with Ryan Englin about what businesses can do to fully leverage the power of the people closest to the work. Englin is a gritty, no bull coach who helps business owners get real about what’s needed to build strong teams that drive business success.

Some of Ryan’s thought-provoking insights include:

What sets Englin apart is his passion for helping small business owners do a lot of the small things that make a big difference. Business big and small will benefit from his wisdom.

Come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome!

If you'd like to meet with Ryan Englin, you can book a complimentary discover call at www.corematters.com

Today, Joris Merks-Benjaminsen joins us from the Netherlands to share his work helping companies cultivate leaders who emphasize both accountability and human connection to achieve extraordinary results. Joris is an award-winning author, brand and marketing expert, successful business leader, and entrepreneur. In 2022, after 22 years in various corporate roles, Joris launched his company, Managing without Power. He also wrote a book by the same title.

Joris personifies the key elements of his work - he is a very nice guy with an edge. He is also a smart, insightful and humble person.

If you would like to talk with Joris about what he can do for your team or organization, you can reach him through his website:
https://www.managingwithoutpower.com

Let’s get started. Come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome!

Bob’ n Joyce look ahead to 2025 and share what workplace pundits tell us what we can expect this year. Instead of regurgitating a boring list, they synthesize them down to the 4 biggies, and then play their “What-if?” game to stimulate our thinking about actions we can take.

There are some pleasant surprises about what the experts* predict resulting in more productive, healthy and fulfilling workplaces. As the title of this podcast implies, the key is to have courage to take action. The courage comes from knowing that in these fluid times, not everything will work.

Come on in. Grab a healthy snack. Welcome!

• Based on Deloitte’s report in Global Human Capital Trends

In this episode, Bob ‘n Joyce put the spotlight on OD/HR practitioners and their role helping organizations navigate these exhilarating but terrifying times. Institutions, governments, and people worldwide are being challenged in ways not seen before.

What can organizational development and HR people do help their companies thrive in these times?

And what can we do on this podcast to support you?

Today, we attempt to answer these questions. Our goal is to be an island of sanity you can visit each week to get inspired and recharged. That why we have showed up every week for over three years. And in doing so, we get ourselves inspired and recharged.

Come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome!

In this episode, Bob ‘n Joyce talk about the emotional highs and lows that surround the holidays. At a time when people feel compelled to be joyful, the holidays can also be a profoundly sad time. Today, we explore the power of expressing both the negative and positive emotions on any given situation or topic. We use the context of the holidays but it applies to most life circumstances and especially to the workplace.

Today’s episode was intended to express the positivity and joy of the season. Instead, Bob ‘n Joyce expose both the magic and hurt of the holidays. It was a cathartic conversation that was just what we both needed. We think you will too, so:

Come on in. Grab a holiday snack. Welcome!

In today’s episode, Bob’nJoyce discuss the impact OD/HR practitioners have shaping culture and transforming organizations. The spotlight, much to her chagrin, is on Joyce and her impact first at Central Maine Power, and later at Hannaford and Delhaize. It underscores the importance of what great leaders do – drive positive change while focusing on the business and its people, and not on themselves.

We are ending 2024 with episodes that inspire thought and positivity. Last week it was about the power of connection and community. This week it is about the work that makes it so. Kudos to my co-host and friend, Joyce Wilson-Sanford – who was and still is a force to be reckoned with.

Come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome.

In this episode, Bob’nJoyce discuss why building community and connection in the workplace should be every leader’s responsibility. Research shows that the loneliness crisis is worsening as people are feel more isolated and marginalized. When this is prevalent in the workplace, overall morale, productivity, and safety suffer.

The opportunity for HR, OD, and Leadership is that a healthy workplace can be just what is needed for people to feel connected and seen. Bob’nJoyce put forward practical steps that leaders can take to promote true connection and camaraderie between employees. These actions, when done well are a win – win – win:

Come on in. Grab a healthy holiday snack. Welcome!

In this episode, Bob’nJoyce rift on the recent trend of abandoning DEI programs in organizations and institutions. Companies that once were the champions of making all voices heard and valued, are tiptoeing, and in some instances, running away from their diversity initiatives. Spoiler alert – we think this is ill-advised and harmful.

There are many reasons for DEI’s demise - a prevailing scarcity mentality (I got mine, go get yours), and the far-right political tsunami to name a few. We believe smart organizations are bucking this trend and are continuing DEI work for the very reason they began them - the business case demands a high performing organization. Call it by another name if you must, but leaders, HR, and OD must carry this work forward.

Come on In. Grab a snack/ Welcome!

In this episode, Bob’nJoyce discussed the power of guided dialogue for jumpstarting a team. This is a non-linear approach where new or struggling teams get together and use the power of dialogue to open up new possibilities and build trust. In HR/OD, some of our most important work involves getting teams and organizations unstuck. This inquiry methodology, in our experience, works better than most other interventions.

We resisted calling this a retreat (Breaking from day-to-day) as the work is a high intensity development experience for participants. The outcome is an accelerated getting clear about the who (we are), the where (we are going), and the why (it matters).

Here are a couple of rules that makes this approach work :

Come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome!

In this episode, Bob’nJoyce muse about the paradox of being 'all in.' With the world in disarray, many consider withdrawing and checking out but more often than not end up choosing engagement and purpose.

So what is going on here? Being all in requires discipline and commitment to weather the tough patches. There is an expression that most of us start with the best of intentions and then life gets in the way. Well Joyce and I have been thrown a lot of life’s curveballs and we are still ‘all in’ on doing this work together. Join us to find out why we think this is so.

Come on in. Grab a Snack. Welcome!

In this episode, Bob’nJoyce muse on the X factor in why some leaders excel and thrive. The context is today’s podcast was recorded on November 5th, America’s election day and a new leader will be chosen. By the time you read this, we all will know the results and hopefully, what we shared will make sense of why either Trump or Harris won. My bet is that the winner possessed many of the attributes of this X Factor.

The bottom line is that while literally tens of thousands of leadership models have been written (We’ve created some of our own), what it often comes down to are a couple of the attributes you will hear today.

So, Come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome.

In this Episode, exactly one week before the U.S. elections, Bob’nJoyce take on the timely topic of getting unstuck when uncertainty and anxiety run rampant.

As a country, we are trying to figure out how to move forward post-election despite half of the country being disappointed and angry. The same is true when a business is suddenly disrupted and what worked before no longer does. Bob’nJoyce lean into their experience and share lessons about ways to get organizations and its people unstuck and moving forward.

Come joins us in this doozy (Joyce’s word) of a topic and join us in taking a much-needed respite from political ads.

Come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome!

In this episode, Joyce shares the characteristics and unique qualities of high performing CEOs she has worked with over her career. Again, Joyce reaches into her treasure chest of written reflections and makes them available to you, our valued listeners. Her observations are anything but your typical list of traits or rigid leadership models. What she shares may surprise you.

In Episode #165, Joyce shared a list of CEO flaws and flubs so it is only fair that we balance that with this episode. It is important to remember that all CEOs have flaws and signature strengths. This “perfect imperfection” is what makes a CEO both fully human and a leader worth following.

There is a lot of really good ‘stuff’ packed in today’s conversation.

Come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome!

In this episode, Bob’nJoyce interview Corey Spitzer - serial entrepreneur, IT expert, start-up guru, and business change agent. Corey is a fractional CTO who helps clients solve the thorniest of product development and business growth challenges. He describes himself as an interpreter of sorts helping tech and business development people communicate and collaborate better.

Corey brings a wealth of experience and stories to help start-up execs get the most from their IT development teams. He is passionate about making a difference in the organizations and people he serves. We all know someone who loves riding on bumpy roads and solving hairy dilemmas. Corey is one of those people. And no, despite describing his work like making sausage, he has never actually done it as best we know.

Come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome!

In this episode, Bob’nJoyce discuss how a network of auto repair tradespeople loosely organize as entrepreneurs to provide value and quality. There are a lot of ideas and lessons to be gleaned from this entrepreneurial innovation - think outsourcing done where everyone, especially the customer, wins. What can the rest of us learn from their example about org structure and how, when, and where work gets done?

In previous episodes, we discussed how org structures and traditional work arrangements are being replaced by innovative, flexible and, at times, counterintuitive approaches. We invite you to get curious about how your company can adapt using this innovative outsource model.

Come on In. Grab a snack. Welcome!

In this episode, Bob’nJoyce discuss ways to unleash our best thinking when feeling stuck. We share concrete ideas to go from linear to lateral thinking that gets the creative juices following. In a world where dull thinking is way too common, these simple but effective ideas promote creativity and new thinking.

You will get:

This episode combines rigorous thinking with fun to bring out the best in our thinking.

Come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome!

In this episode, Bob’nJoyce discuss CEO flaws and flubs they observed while working with them. CEO’s are human and therefore imperfect. The good news is that those we worked with possessed strengths that offset their shortcomings. Come listen and assess which flaws you may have.

Some of the flaws they observed include:

Failure to stay disciplined about messaging what matters most again and again..
Being susceptible to flattery and praise that impacts judgment.
Failure to hold in check the privilege and entitlement of power.
Not staying in touch with the grit of the business.
Being too protective and not demanding enough

We grimaced a lot at our own flaws and suspect you will too so buckle up.

So come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome!

In this episode, Bob’nJoyce address the challenge of moving from personal or organizational lethargy to vitality. Good leaders can sense the pulse of an organization and find ways to move the needle on the cultural vibe. So the question becomes how do you engage employees in order to make the shift?

Here are a couple of areas we mused on:

Responding to, ‘Well, it is what it is.’
Combating the malaise of boredom at work.
The importance of leaning into the discomfort through dialogue (versus measuring it through stay surveys).
The power of putting a name on what’s happening.

Joyce and Bob get feisty and gritty about what they believe is an oft ignored but important aspect of a healthy organization.

Come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome!

In this episode, Bob’nJoyce muse on the merits and limitations of setting goals. Goal setting can both energize and move you to action but can also discourage and demotivate. It begs the question as to how you accomplish the former and avoid the latter. This topic is timely given the 2024 Paris Olympics and the stories athletes share about how they became the best in the world. The recurring theme is the power of goal setting that propelled them to become the best. The conundrum is to tap into that kind of goal setting and avoid that which distracts and bores.

Some take-a-ways include:

So come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome!

In this episode, Bob’nJoyce, go through a recent post where the author describes leadership attributes that makes a person worth following. While there are many leadership models, this one focuses on affinity, the ability to connect with others based on mutual respect and trust. The behaviors and attributes described in today’s podcast serves as a guide to assess how we are doing. Come listen to learn where you are nailing it and where you just might see an opportunity to be a better leader.

Come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome!

In this episode, Bob’nJoyce rift on the importance of an organization’s culture being seen and understood. Our definition of culture is the way that a group solves problems, make decisions, and gets the work done. When these norms or assumptions no longer work, making your culture tangible and seen, is the first step to cultural change. To do this, we share ideas on how you can lead a conversation to make the unseen seen by having groups discuss these dimensions on a continuum of how things happen around here:

Conflict – Direct and blunt or indirect and polite
Tolerance for ambiguity – order and completeness or raggedy and chaotic
Awareness of time – Fixed or fluid
Emotions – expressive or controlled
Perspective on the business – data/finance or intuition/art
Freedom – Hierarchical or egalitarian
Dress – Formal or informal
Communication – Explicit and direct or implicit and indirect

Great stuff here so…

Come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome!

In this episode, Bob’nJoyce share a list of OD values created by a team Joyce worked with several years ago. The list resonated with them but what matters more is if they ring true to you. These values are not exclusive to OD practitioners and apply to all of us who lead and we all lead at something.

You probably won’t find these values on the ODN website or in an academic leadership article. This list is borne out of hard work, determination, and yes, screwing up. Our hope is after listening, you take a moment to reflect on the values important to doing your best work.

Here are a few of ours:

Embrace humor.
Don’t take yourself too seriously and know when you are up on your high horse.
Reside on the boundary.
Know when you are kissing ass and betraying your work.
Shrug when you screw up.

Come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome!

In this episode, Bob’nJoyce discuss the importance of HR/OD abandoning worn out approaches and rules that no longer cut it. In fact, past practices too often stifle creativity and employee engagement. The role of OD is to “supersize” the capacity and potential of their workforce. Sounds too idealistic and soft? We think not. Taking this on demands courage and patience.

Warning: We get irritated and a wee bit sarcastic in today’s podcast. Despite this…

Come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome!

In this episode, Bob’nJoyce speak out about stuff that irritates the heck out of them. Leaders too often fail to treat employees respectfully, especially at times that matter most. It is almost as if common sense and decency go out the window. Here is some of the stuff that irritates them:

The arrogance of viewing employees as problems to be solved versus as the solution

Letting people go without respect and compassion
Those who manage and manipulate and call it leading
Managers who ‘do to’ versus ‘doing with’ employees

Get ready to get irritated!

In this episode, our guest, Andrea Derler, shares how people analytics empowers HR and leaders to align HR strategy with business goals like never before. Organizations are increasing under greater pressure to increase employee engagement and performance outcomes. Join us today to learn how people analytics can unlock the untapped value of your employees.

Come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome

_About Dr. Andrea Derler
Andrea Derler, has been leading research projects in the HR field in both U.S. and European companies for over 10 years and has been with Visier, a Canadian software company and a leader in the People Analytics domain, since 2021. In this interview, she will provide a practical introduction to the discipline of People Analytics, share the hottest HR trends of 2024, and offer insights into current case examples from the HR and people analytics practice. _

In this episode, Bob’nJoyce share thought-provoking question for leaders and HR/OD practitioners. Some questions come from Gallup consulting, and the rest from Joyce’s own writings. Asking a powerful question is a valuable tool for providing insights, shifting perspectives (in a good way), and revealing blind spots. They can also irritate the dickens out of you.

Come join us as we rift on each and provide our thoughts on where and when to use them. We blend humor, a bit of sarcasm, and brilliant insights that will make you both smile and grimace.

Spoiler Alert!!!! Here is the list of Joyce's touchstone Leadership Questions:

— Would you do the same job for half the salary?
— Do you have something preposterously important you want to get done?
— Do you think about ‘better’ or ‘different’?
— Do you look forward to developing, thinking with, being demanding of,
infusing with enthusiasm, your direct reports?
— Does the idea of contact with the core of your business excite you or
bore you?
—Do you take reality into serious consideration but not bow to it?
—When people see you coming, do they want to do good work and after you leave, do they want to do their best work?
— Do you often realize that you owe your privileged role to every person in your company and does it make you determined to make them proud of you?

Some of these I know grabed your attention and interest so...
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In this episode, Bob’nJoyce rift on the merits and relevance of creating self-organizing communities. Whether it be in the fabric of an organization’s culture or a one-time intervention, taking a decentralized approach for problem solving, co-creation, and vitality works. In this episode we asks as many questions as we answers so buckle up because we need you on this topic.

We touch on:
How self-organizing unleashes tapped down energy and promotes engagement.
The importance of trust that communities will get it right
Working through the panic that this might just not work
How to embrace a decentralized approach in a hierarchical, top-down organization.

Come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome!

In this episode, Bob’nJoyce delve into the practice of setting norms of behavior for meetings. Norm setting is a game changer for effective engagement but too often doesn’t work. We provide tips and ideas on how to establish norms that work.

Why is this an important topic?

• Many meetings are waste of time and talent.
• Meetings done well are where real work gets done.
• Norms are a powerful intervention to promote a productive culture.

Come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome!

In this episode, Bob’nJoyce sit down with Terry Morgan, an accomplished executive known for his change leadership as a CEO, CIO, interim executive, and technology consultant. Terry has led large scale transformations at companies including Food Lion, Delhaize, and Lowe's Home Improvement. Terry shares insights for navigating significant change with a thoughtful approach resulting in successful, high impact outcomes. Some of those insights include:
• Ways to address resistance to change
• Why taking risk is necessary and the importance of mitigating it
• The flywheel of things to consider when leading big change
• The importance of getting stakeholder involved in the change process

This episode is packed with good stuff so……Come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome!

About Terry Morgan
Principal, Morgan Advisory Services, LLC.

Mr. Terry Morgan is a seasoned senior executive with deep and diverse experience in industry and consulting. He retired as the CEO of Macro Integration Services, Inc. and has been the sole principal of Morgan Advisory Services, LLC (www.morganadv.com) since 2010. He has over 40 years of industry and consulting experience in strategic planning, technology, retail services, business process improvement, cost optimization, and general management. After his grocery career as the Global CIO of Delhaize Group, he served interim executive roles via Morgan Advisory Services at Extended Stay America (Interim CIO), Belk (Interim CTO), AMTdirect (Consultant and Board Member), Delhaize America (Interim CTO, Interim Office of the CIO), Lowe’s (Interim CIO, Interim CISO, and Interim SVP of Technology – Canada). In most cases, he hired the permanent replacement as well as ran the function.

Mr. Morgan has served in a volunteer mentoring capacity with Rowan County Times Two Mentoring and Queens College. He has his MBA from the Fuqua School of Business with an emphasis in Finance, his BS from the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill with a major Business Administration and Accounting and is a Certified Management Accountant.

In this episode, Bob’nJoyce share 12 principles or truths about organizational change. This list is based on the work of Margaret Wheatley, author, leadership guru, and management consultant. We time-test these truths using our experiences and invite you to do the same.

Here is sample of some:

Whatever the problem, community is the answer. Diversity is a blessing, not a problem. A leader is anyone willing to engage. People support what they create. Change happens through emergence, not by any other process.

Come on in. Grab a snack. Welcome!