What It Was Like

In 1995, Dale Wheatley had just written and produced Don's Plum starring his friends Leonardo DiCaprio and Tobey Maguire. The film was quickly snapped up for a 3-picture deal. But then Leo decided he didn't want it released. Overnight, he and Tobey buried the film and dismantled Dale's friendships. As he explains, it’s a moment he’s never recovered from.

You can watch Don's Plum on Dale’s YouTube here

Dale's memoir, Too Real, is also available on his website here

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Pamela Jones was born into a fringe splinter group of Mormonism. By her early 30s she had nine children, while her husband had five other wives. But one day something inside her broke. In this ep, Pamela describes how she escaped — penniless and illiterate — and built a multimillion-dollar business and a whole new life.

Hire Pamela to speak at your next event here

Read her incredible memoir, The Dirt Beneath Our Door: My Journey to Freedom after Escaping a Polygamous Mormon Cult

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In 1981, an Israeli backpacker named Yossi Ghinsberg met a man in Bolivia who told him about a lost city of riches buried in the jungle. Four of them went into the Amazon to search for the city. Two came out. Yossi tells us how he survived and what he learned about the darkness within.

Hire Yossi to speak at your next event here

Read his incredible memoir, Jungle, here

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On the eve of his 38th birthday in 1998, a lawyer named Stanley Alpert was plucked off the street by three armed men. For the next 25 hours he sat blindfolded in a corner of their Brooklyn apartment, listening to their strange lives play out around him, and carefully absorbing their stories so he could have them jailed, should he ever escape.

For more, check out Stan’s book The Birthday Party: A Memoir of Survival

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In May 1999, police found eight bodies decaying in barrels in a disused bank vault in Snowtown. Four men were eventually jailed for 12 murders. Former senior constable Gordon Drage was the first to discover the vault and tells us what he saw.. We're re-running this 2023 interview because the youngest of the four, James Vlassakis, has just been approved for parole. It’s a decision that’s being fought out in the South Australian Supreme Court.

If you’re a subscriber, please contribute your episode ideas and questions here.

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Todd Maguire was happy-go-lucky Australian policeman until his girlfriend died by suicide and everything changed. From there, Todd became a heavy drinking undercover cop chasing life-and-death situations to bury his trauma. This is Todd’s story of going to hell but somehow finding his way back.

Check out Todd’s memoir: Donny: An undercover cop with a deathwish.

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In 2018, sci-fi writer Patrick Tomlinson posted a Tweet that attracted the attention of a group of far-right internet trolls. As their harassment escalated, Patrick called the police, who did nothing. Now, nearly eight years later, Patrick’s life has been upended via a campaign of doxing, swatting and relentless terrorising. On this ep, he explains how this nightmare can happen to anyone.

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In 2019, Matthew Thomas thought he was joining a Bible study group. Instead, he was sucked into Shincheonji Church of Jesus, a secretive Korean cult known for coercive control and bankrupting its members. Over the next four years, Matt lost himself and eventually became a recruiter tasked with drawing others in.

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In 2004, Jon Romano brought a shotgun to school intending to take his own life. One person was injured before he was tackled to the ground. Today, Jon reflects on the path that led him there—and what he wishes he’d told the people around him sooner.

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In 2003, Jayson Blair was a rising star in journalism, until he got caught plagiarising stories and inventing details. What followed was one of the most high-profile downfalls in modern media. In this ep, Jayson reflects on why he lied, how he got away with it for so long, and how it felt when everything collapsed.

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After Brooke Knisley fell from a tree, she couldn’t walk, talk, or remember anything—or anyone. So when a man appeared claiming to be her boyfriend, she believed him. What followed was months of manipulation, as she slowly uncovered who he really was.

This is a recent episode from our other show, The Sex That Changed My Life. Find it wherever you get your podcasts.

You can follow Brooke on Instagram here and TikTok here.

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The Cannonball Run is an illegal car race from New York to Los Angeles. In 1972, Judy Stropus entered with an all-women team sponsored by a bra company. They didn’t finish, but somehow became the most legendary team in Cannonball history. In this ep, Judy recounts the race and explains why she considers it the dumbest thing she ever did.

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Between 1974 and 1978, Ted Bundy confessed to killing 30 women. During that time, he was especially close with his cousin, Edna Cowell Martin. In this episode, Edna shares what it was like growing up with him. From small, unsettling moments, to the shock of discovering who he really was.

For more of Edna’s story, check out her memoir, Dark Tide: Growing Up with Ted Bundy.

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On August 9, 1996, the cast and crew of Titanic wrapped a long shoot with a seafood dinner. Within an hour, around 40 people (including director James Cameron) were ill. The cause: someone had spiked their chowder with a hallucinogenic drug called PCP. In this ep, camera operator Jamie Barber recounts how the night spiralled into a hospital trip… and a conga line.

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It's one of the weirdest mysteries we've encountered. On this week's episode, we speak to Brett Grimes, who was 19 when he a got a job digging a huge hole in the forested side of a volcano, with no explanation of what they were digging for. In this episode, Brett recounts the most dangerous job of his life and what they found at the bottom.

We found this story via the independent documentary The Hole Story. Stay across screenings via their Facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/TheHoleStoryMovie/

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In 1973, a raft carrying five men and six women set off across the Atlantic to answer the age-old question: what causes human violence? The expedition’s leader, anthropologist Santiago Genovés, believed the answer lay in sexual tension, earning the mission the nickname "The Sex Raft." In this episode, crew member Fé Seymour looks back on a voyage marked by hurricanes, epiphanies, and one mutiny.

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Since 2020, orcas have been attacking sailing boats off the coasts of Spain and Portugal. Experts initially thought the behaviour was a passing fad, but six years later, it shows no sign of stopping. In this episode, British yachtsman Robert Powell describes the day a pod of orcas methodically disabled and sank his boat — and the surprising thing the coast guard told him after the rescue.

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When American millionaire John Bender moved to Costa Rica with his wife Ann, they set out to build a dream life in the jungle. Instead, their relationship spiralled into madness. When Bender died from a gunshot wound in 2010, the question remained: was it suicide or murder? Journalist Carol Vaughn takes us inside one of Costa Rica’s strangest cases.

Check out Carol's book on the case: Crazy Jungle Love: Murder, Madness, Money & Monkeys

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In 1967, 14-year-old Connie Geldreich met a young man at a lake who called himself Ted. What began as a strange encounter escalated into something far more disturbing. In this episode, Connie recounts her memories of a man who would later become the world's most famous serial killer.

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Alice was in her late 30s when she reinvented her life. She left her marriage and started prioritising herself for the first time ever. That journey led her to open a happy ending massage parlour for women. This is the first episode of our new podcast: The Sex That Changed My Life. A show about the intimate moments that transform us.

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Douglas Robertson was a teenager when his family set out to sail the world on a yacht. Seventeen months into the voyage, orcas sank the boat in the Pacific. In this ep, Douglas describes 38 days adrift in a small dinghy, surviving on turtle blood and rainwater.

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Rick Hogg was a Melbourne accountant who specialised in minimising tax by fabricating expenses. In 2018, it all imploded and Rick got five years in prison. In this episode, he explains how the scheme worked, why he crossed the line, and what the ordeal taught him about greed.

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Robert Kerbeck was a broke actor when he stumbled into corporate espionage. His job was to trick low-level employees into divulging company secrets, which he sold for big money. In this episode, he explains what the work taught him about lying and the shortcomings of American capitalism.

Check out Robert's book: Ruse

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Vanessa Mitchell thought she was buying the home of her dreams. Sure, it was a medieval prison for English peasants accused of witchcraft, but it was cute and within her price range. But then her possessions started vanishing and she found a mysterious pool of blood on the floor and three years later she was out, fleeing with her son. This is Vanessa's story of what happened.

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Flor Edwards grew up in the Children of God, an authoritarian sect that taught its followers that the world would end in 1993. In this episode, she reflects on how it felt growing up expecting to die, and how the group responded when the apocalypse never came.

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Lily Rose Lee was 21 when she accepted a ride from her friend’s father. She was 32 when she finally escaped his house, along with two other women. In this episode, Lily recounts what 11 years in captivity did to her body and mind, how she survived, and what she learned about resilience.

You can connect with Lily Rose Lee on Facebook

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Greg Abandoned is an urbex YouTuber who visits the world’s most wild and forgotten places. A few years ago, he trekked into the Kazakh desert to explore a secret Russian military facility that houses abandoned space shuttles from the Soviet Union. In this episode, Greg recounts the journey and why he wishes he’d chosen his travel companion more carefully.

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In 2015, Jeremy Morris bought a house in Idaho to host the Christmas display of his dreams. Within weeks he was locked in a bitter feud with his neighbours over religious freedom and civil liberties. In this episode, Jeremy tells his side of a very modern American culture war.

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In February 1982, the body of a wildlife photographer named Carl McCunn was found in northern Alaska. A miscommunication had left him stranded and McCunn had documented his final cold months in a journal. In this episode, journalist Kris Capps walks us through McCunn’s forgotten story, mostly in his own words.

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Sometimes Vivian Conan saw herself in the mirror. Other times she saw others with their own distinct personalities and backstories. At 43, she was diagnosed with Dissociative Identity Disorder, formally known as Multiple Personality Disorder. In this episode, Vivian describes her life-long journey to meet and merge her different selves.

Get in touch with Vivian or find her book via her website: vivianconan.com

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In 2022, Samantha Stites was abducted by Christopher Thomas, a man who’d been stalking her for 13 years and had secretly built a soundproof bunker to imprison her. In this episode, Samantha shares how she escaped and what the ordeal taught her about survival.

Support Samantha's initiative to protect victims of stalking and domestic violence: Beekeepers Advocacy

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Thomas Hargrove was an investigative reporter when he had an idea: use open-source FBI data to spot patterns in unsolved murders. That idea became an algorithm that highlights locations where serial killers might be operating. In this episode, Thomas talks us through the cases it’s uncovered and why data can reveal what people miss.

Visit Thomas' organisation the Murder Accountability Project at www.murderdata.org.

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In 2001, Detective Hugh Lockerby found a woman and two children murdered inside a burning home in Scottsdale, Arizona. The missing husband, Robert William Fisher, became the prime suspect and has sat on the top of the FBI's most wanted list for 24 years. Lockerby explains why he believes Fisher is alive and why he can't let this case go.

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High in the Himalayas lies Roopkund Lake: a frozen pond surrounded by the remains of around 700 people. Were they victims of an ancient disaster, a lost army, or something stranger? We speak with anthropologist William Sax and geneticist Éadaoin Harney to unravel one of India’s most haunting archaeological mysteries.

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At 35, Gregory Smith walked into the rainforest of northern NSW, addicted, lost, and ready to disappear. He spent the next decade living as a hermit. When he finally walked out, he got sober, went to university, and built a new life. We talk about how nature can strip you bare before healing you.

Check out Dr. Gregory Smith's website and charity.

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You might’ve seen 'Woman of the Hour' on Netflix but this is the real story. In 1979, a 12-year-old girl vanished from Huntington Beach and Detective Craig Robison was assigned to the case. He tells us how he tracked down her killer, a man who had already murdered at least seven women, and how they eventually identified him on national TV as a dating show contestant.

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This week we're re-running a favourite episode. In 1985, a 17-year-old girl named Shari Smith was abducted from her driveway and the family's phone started to ring. It was the kidnapper, his voice electronically distorted. He called repeatedly and it fell on Shari's 21-year-old sister Dawn to answer. In this episode, Dawn Smith Jordan recalls what she learned that week about her her sister's courage and her own resilience.

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Today, we’re speaking with a man who lost his foot in a motorcycle accident and then served it to 10 friends for brunch. It’s a conversation about curiosity, taboos—and yes, we ask the question you want to know: what does human meat actually taste like?

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In 2004, a man named Marvin Heemeyer turned a bulldozer into a homemade tank and tore through Granby, Colorado, targeting people he believed had wronged him. One was local newspaper editor Patrick Brower, who barely escaped as the “Killdozer” demolished his office. Patrick recalls the rampage and what it revealed to him about vigilante revenge.

For more of Patrick's story, check out his book Killdozer: The True Story of the Colorado Bulldozer Rampage

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Chris Smith started experimenting with ChatGPT in 2024 and quickly became hooked. Soon he’d customised the chatbot into a flirty persona he named “Sol.” What began as curiosity evolved into a full-blown romantic relationship. One that nearly derailed his real-life partnership. In this episode, Chris opens up about how his AI “affair” began, why it became so intense, and how it affected his family.

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Jill Dodd was a 21-year-old model when she started dating one of the world's richest men. Adnan Khashoggi made billions selling arms to Saudi Arabia and lived in mansions, superyachts, and among an entourage of women. Jill tells what it was like to live inside that fairy tale and the hidden costs that it entailed.

Check out Jill's memoir: The Currency of Love: A Courageous Journey to Finding the Love Within

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In the late 1980s, Steve was a teenage firefighter in a small Australian coastal town. Lonely and looking for connection, he discovered that if he lit a fire in the nearby national park, he could impress the other firefighters by being the first on the scene. In this ep, Steve explains how getting caught and charged with arson saved his life, and possibly countless others.

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On September 11, 2001, Stanley Praimnath was on the top floor of the South Tower when he saw the second plane heading straight for his office. Against impossible odds, he survived and became one of a tiny number of people to escape from above the impact zone. In this 9/11 anniversary episode, Stanley recounts what it was like to be at the top of the World Trade Centre that morning.

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With Brad Pitt back in the spotlight thanks to F1, we’re revisiting a classic episode from 2022. Casting director Lauren Lloyd recalls meeting a young, pimply Pitt in the 1980s and instantly knowing he’d become a star. In this episode, we unpack the making of Brad Pitt as an actor and as a Hollywood institution. Stay listening at the end for a sneak peek of this week's subscriber bonus episode.

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In 2003, a Wall Street trader named John Rusnak was convicted of bank fraud and sentenced to more than seven years in prison. In this episode, John explains how a series of bad bets snowballed into one of the biggest white-collar crimes in US history and why he kept doubling down.

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A family moves into a new home in rural Pennsylvania and starts renovating. Only there's something in the walls that doesn't make sense. What they uncover upends their lives and reveals a fascinating piece of America’s history.

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In 2009, motivational speaker James Arthur Ray hosted a multi-day retreat in Arizona. On the final day, three participants died. In this episode, the property’s owner, Amayra Hamilton, tells us what happened and what she learned about the dark side of the wellness industry.

For more, please check out Amayra's book: Transformation at Angel Valley

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For decades, David Magna worked as a safety supervisor in Canadian slaughterhouses. But then a crisis of conscience turned him from an industry insider to vegan activist. In this episode, we tackle the thing most people would rather ignore: what really goes on inside the meat industry—all through the lens of David’s personal journey.

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As a child, April Balascio noticed that people would often vanish. One time it was a labourer working for her dad, another time it was a young couple in town. Then as an adult, April started googling cold cases in her childhood towns. In 2009 she got a match and called the police. In this episode, April shares the journey of realising (and accepting) her dad was a serial killer.

Check out April's incredible memoir, Raised By a Serial Killer

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In 1995, Carlos de Yarza spent 90 minutes remixing a catchy Spanish song without giving it much thought. That version became 'The Macarena' the world knows today. Carlos joins us to talk about how a quick remix changed his life and created a dance craze known everywhere.

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In 1994, a luxurious ferry called the MS Estonia sank in the Baltic Sea, drowning most of its passengers. Landscape architect Paul Barney was one of the few who survived. In this nail-biting episode, he describes how decisiveness, yoga training, and sheer luck kept him alive.

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In 2019, two children vanished in Idaho, sparking an investigation that became one of America’s biggest true crime stories. At the centre were Chad and Lori Daybell, two religious fanatics with a fixation on the end times. In this episode, we speak with Lieutenant Ray Hermosillo, the detective who cracked the case and uncovered the kids' tragic end.

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When Kevin Briggs joined the San Francisco Highway Patrol, he didn’t expect a key part of his job would be talking people down from the Golden Gate Bridge. In this episode, Kevin shares how he developed a method for these life-or-death conversations, and tells the stories of those he met and the words that brought them back.

Follow Kevin on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kevinbriggspivotalpoints/

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In 1991, Shaun Attwood arrived from the UK to find American rave culture in its infancy. Spotting an opportunity, he began importing potent Dutch ecstasy and built a drug empire through his network of dealers and party organisers. In this episode, he tells the story of his rapid rise and hard fall.

Check out Shaun Attwood’s YouTube channel here. His books and social media accounts can be found here.

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A new study gave psilocybin to religious leaders, just to see whether their faith would be affirmed or rattled. In this episode we hear from one participant, Islamic leader Sughra Ahmed, who describes how the trip brought her closer to God but uprooted her belief in organised religion.

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Mary McGriff was 15 when she hitched a ride with a man named Lawrence Singleton. The next day, she lay at the bottom of a cliff, her arms severed with an axe. Somehow, she survived. In this episode, she shares how a voice in her head kept her going. It's a story about refusing to let the monster win.

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This week, we're re-running a classic. When abandoned farm houses started catching fire in rural Virginia, police weren't sure what to think. It took five months and almost 80 fires for a couple to be arrested and the story to emerge. In this episode, convicted arsonist Charlie Smith explains how he and his ex-partner lit fires to relax when their relationship soured.

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In the early 90s, Paul Templer ran a business guiding clients down the Zambezi River near Victoria Falls. One afternoon, he was attacked by a hippo and found himself halfway down its throat. In this ep, Paul regales us with his wild story of survival, moment by moment.

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In 2005, Malcolm Naden murdered two women and vanished into the Australian bush. For seven years he evaded police, until former detective Ricky Hennessy joined the case. In this episode, Hennessy shares how he helped track and capture one of Australia's most wanted men in remote wilderness.

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John DeLorean was a star auto designer in the 1960s, but his own car company—the DeLorean Motor Company—never took off. When a cocaine deal offered a last-ditch lifeline, it ended in a dramatic arrest. In this episode, his daughter Kat DeLorean recounts the rise and fall of the iconic car—and how it found immortality in Back to the Future.

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In 1976, 20-year-old Rob Hunter was a month into his first teaching job at a remote Australian school when an armed gunman abducted him and his nine students. In this episode, Rob recounts the harrowing night they spent as hostages—and their dramatic escape via a high-speed car chase.

Connect with Rob and book him to speak at your school at https://kidnappedteachertalks.com/.

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Last year, 23-year-old British porn star Lily Phillips announced plans to break the world record for the most sexual partners in a day—starting with a “practice run” involving 100 men. In this episode, she tells us what's motivating her, how her first attempt affected her—and why she’s still determined to go the whole way.

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In the mid-80s, producer Linda Gottlieb heard a friend’s story about “dirty dancing” at summer camp and urged her to write a script. Despite rejections, budget cuts, and on-set drama, the film became a surprise hit. In this episode, Linda shares why she believed in it from the start—and what she saw that others missed. 

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In 2024, Cass Taulaki fell pregnant to the man of her dreams—a 32-year-old engineer in the Australian Defence Force. Or so she thought. In reality, he was unemployed and wanted for impersonating military personnel and skipping out on multiple families. Cass' TikTok story went viral earlier this year—and now she's sharing the full saga.

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In the early 2000s, musician Nathan Munn moved into a tiny, ornate apartment in Montreal. At first, he and his flatmates brushed off its strange energy—but the nightmares and disturbances wore them down. Now, Nathan believes the apartment just wanted to be noticed.

Check out Nathan's music on Spotify

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In 2012, a cruise liner named the Costa Concordia sank off the coast of Italy, killing 32 people. But Australian couple Rob and Tracy Elcombe survived and the disaster brought them closer.

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The Awá, an Indigenous group in Brazil's Amazon, had no contact with the outside world until recently. In 2010, BBC journalist Justin Rowlatt visited them in their new reserve, created to protect them from loggers. In this episode, he explores how modern pressures are impacting isolated tribes and what his ongoing friendship with the Awá has taught him about humanity.

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In 2009, Kari Ferrell was outed by the media for writing bad checks and robbing trust fund babies across Manhattan. Dubbed the 'Hipster Grifter,' Kari served a year in prison and is now sharing her story. In this episode, she unpacks her motivations, her methods, and what she learned about the psychology of grifting.

Check out Kari's new memoir: You'll Never Believe Me.

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This is the first episode of our new What It Was Like series, SCAMMERLAND. It's based on an episode we did last year, looking at how online scams are run by people living in modern slavery. We start our story with Small Q, a young Ugandan rapper and singer who thought he was traveling to Thailand for a dream job. However, everything changed the moment he stepped off the plane.

Follow our new show SCAMMERLAND on Spotify, Apple and YouTube

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Hosted byJulian Morgans @julianmorgans

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In 2015, wellness influencer Belle Gibson was outed for pretending to have cancer. Now she's back in the headlines thanks to a new show on Netflix. In this episode we talk to a woman named Beckii Jones, who once considered Belle a friend. She ran a Facebook group for mothers in the early 2010s when Belle joined and even suggested the name for her infamous app, The Whole Pantry. Beckii reflects on the woman she knew and the parts of Belle that remain a mystery.

Follow our new show SCAMMERLAND. It's based on a two-part episode we did last year on What it Was Like about scammer farms and it's on Spotify, Apple and YouTube.

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Tornado chasing was a niche hobby when Tim Marshall started in the 1970s. But over time, he watched it grow in popularity and then explode into the mainstream with the 1996 release of the film Twister. In this episode, Tim reflects on the times he was lucky to make it home, the friends who didn't, and the "internetization" of his beloved past time.

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Julie Lindahl always knew there was something different about her family. Her German grandparents had fled to Brazil after the war, but she didn't know why. Until she discovered her grandfather was in the SS—the elite guard of the Nazi regime, responsible for some of their worst atrocities. In this episode, Julie explores guilt, accountability, and why confronting the past is the key to healing.

Julie's book, The Pendulum, is available here on Amazon.

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In 2014, Laurence Hearn was drinking too much and struggling to make ends meet. Then he accidentally got stuck in a washing machine. What followed was a series of unexpected events that would ultimately turn his life around. This is a one-of-a-kind tale of Australian larrikinism—told by the man who lived it.

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In 1989, Melissa Fyfe was a high school student in Tasmania when her classmate killed his parents and younger brother. Shocked, the community buried the tragedy, leaving his motives a mystery. Now, Melissa shares what she uncovered when she finally started asking questions.

Trigger warning: this episode contains child abuse themes.

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In 2019, a man named Fraser Harvey nominated himself 'Customer of the Week' at a Melbourne coffee shop. A woman named Harriett Noall retaliated and a game of oneupmanship arose. In this episode, we hear how a private prank accidentally became an internet sensation.

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It was June 1987 and an unknown person had murdered five campers in Australia's remote northwest. In this episode, we speak with Bob Brown, the former leader of Western Australia's Tactical Response Group. Bob and his team were flown into the Kimberley region to find and arrest the murderer. But, as you’ll hear, things didn’t go exactly as planned.

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Mark Edmondson was ranked 212th when he was invited to compete at the 1976 Australian Open. He was a 21-year-old with sideburns, juggling odd jobs to fund his tennis dreams. In this episode, Mark recounts the experience of defeating his idols to win—then accidentally dropping the trophy on the podium.

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In 2003, a pizza deliveryman robbed a Pennsylvania bank with a bomb locked to his neck—a heist that ended in tragedy when the bomb exploded. The mastermind? Marjorie Diehl-Armstrong, later sentenced to life in prison. In this episode, we hear from criminologist Kathryn Whiteley who befriended Marjorie behind bars and uncovers how and why this "evil genius" orchestrated such a bizarre crime.

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Myah Morgenstern isn't famous. But when she met actor Tony Revolori, (Spiderman, The Grand Budapest Hotel, Scream), she was ushered into a whole new world of red carpets, VIP parties and weird social dynamics. In this episode, Myah describes her real-life Notting Hill experience of dating a celebrity as a non-famous person.

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In the lead up to Christmas of 1980, three Woolworths stores were bombed around New South Wales. It's a crazy story involving Australia's largest supermarket chain, two larrikin crooks, and a $1 million ransom thrown into the Sydney Harbour. We'll hear about it from two people: Former police officer Allan Duncan who was injured in one of the explosions, and Forgotten Australiapodcast host, Michael Adams.

This is a rerun from 2022 but it's one of our favourite Christmas throwbacks so we're giving it a second play. If you haven't already heard it, enjoy.

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Sandra Miller wasn't overly concerned when her therapist partner's client admitted to eavesdropping outside their window. Until this client started calling the house, relentlessly. In this episode, we dive into a real life version of 'Fatal Attraction' to learn what happens when a stalker invades a relationship.\

Check out Sandra's USA TODAY best-selling book Wednesdays at One. It's a great read.

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Julian Morgans, host of What it Was Like, gets parking fines all the time. In his own words "I could wallpaper my house with them." But instead of doing that, he's embarked on a scheme to get revenge, while learning a few things about the inner workings of the parking industry along the way.

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Narelle Fraser spent much of her career in Victoria's Rape and Homicide squads, placing her at the coalface of the epidemic of violence against women. In this episode, she walks us through the murder of Melbourne-mother Maria Korp, as a way to explore the mindset of men who perpetrate such violence.

Keep up to date with Narelle and find links to her podcast here

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